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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: vairsUPnorth ()
Date: May 05, 2018 07:05PM

My wife and I have managed to always maintain a fleet of manual transmission DD's since we got our licenses in the 1970's, so we can't say we ever miss them. We do get to suffer through automatics on the occasions when one of our DD's is in the shop and we have a loaner.

As long as it is possible we will continue to search for used M/T replacements when the current cars rust away. That said, we never buy new cars. I think it is insane to buy a $35k car or $60k truck and subject it to six months of MDOT's daily salt bath. However, I would break down and buy a brand new mid-sized 4X4 truck, SUV or AWD minivan if it were ever to become available with a diesel/manual option [the Lions are more likely to win the Super Bowl].

My wife and I especially like manual transmissions for driving in snow or on slippery roads, where we can feather the clutch to avoid wheel spin to get going, or down shift to safely descend a steep hill [when ABS will simply buzz and let you roll right down]--there is no substitute. Rocking a car to get unstuck is a nightmare when you have an automatic that will not shift fast enough. I plow snow with my 01 Dodge Cummins/6-sp and would not have it any other way and have developed techniques to stack snow 8-10' high that would be next to impossible to do with an automatic truck. BTW I plow my own driveway and 5/8 mile road, a commercial lot, 5 rental property lots and occasionally our church's 250 car parking lot. (and we got 314" of snow this year)

Our current DD's:
01 Dodge 3500 SRW Quad SWB 5.9 Cummins/6-sp w/Boss 9 ft V-plow
04 Jeep Liberty 2.4L(gas)/6-sp (the 2.8 CRD/6-sp was available overseas but not here)
05 Subaru Legacy GT 2.5L-Turbo/5-sp (the low CG of this car is so much like a Corvair)
01 Chrysler P/T Cruiser 2.4L/5-sp (w/ Hakkapeliitta's this is a pretty good winter car)

My son has a 07 Subaru Legacy with automatic [even though he learned to drive and took his test in the Jeep]. It has a convenient to use manual mode on the shifter, not paddles, that I can tolerate.

Dale Dewald
Hancock, MI

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: American Mel ()
Date: May 05, 2018 11:27PM

Well, I can say one thing, J3M is correct about Chrome Shift knobs!
My first vehicle had one, and on a hot day it WOULD burn your hand!
Funny, I was just going through some old boxes in the garage this last week and found that old shift knob.
For just 1 minute, I considered installing it in my '66.
Then I remembered those scorched palms on hot days, and decided that it might not be such a good idea!
OH! It is not so great on sub-freezing mornings either ! ! ! eye popping smiley

.
-----------------------------------------------
WA. state, 1 mile south of the Canadian border,
I am not at the end of the world, but you can see it from here.
'66 Monza Coupe - 4spd, 140 Daily driver beater
'67 Monza Vert. - PG, 140 Daily driver beater

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: red monza ()
Date: May 06, 2018 05:43AM

While my corvette is a T top car, I have had the tops off many times when I was much younger....and I have a heavy orig steel ball knob....not one time do I ever remember getting burned...maybe I had tougher hands or parked it so the sun did not interfere with turning it into a burner or shifted much faster, I know I have shifted it with 2 fingers only, maybe because of a hot shift knob...maybe everyone lives in a very hot state that reported being burned by a shifter knob...now the black seats in my 66 will feels like they will burn you when in shorts...changing that soon. Going to an off white with Aqui sides.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/06/2018 05:47AM by red monza.

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: kenzen ()
Date: May 06, 2018 05:58AM

When I lived in NYC, manual was a PITA, and my PG vair restoration was all about not dealing with shifting in traffic all the time. Now that I'm in the hills of Maryland, my DD is a S10 2.2 5 speed, and I wish the vair was a manual. However, putting my kids and dog in the vair, getting milk shakes at the local "Arctic Circle", and then taking a ride in the back hills is far easier with my right hand free to hold the milk shake. smiling smiley

Ken

kenzen
66 Monza Coupe 110/PG
Bel Air, MD

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: stitch ()
Date: May 06, 2018 06:08AM

Younger car thieves will tend to 'walk right by' a stick shift for easier prey. Not that automatics are more in demand, but for the simple reason that many of them never learned how to drive a stick. Some probably don't even know what the "3rd pedal" is for...

"If you can't fix it with a Hammer, you have an Electrical problem."
Stitch...
Schertz, Texas.
(Smallish town/burg 17 mi. NE of San Antonio)

!967.. 4th body
8th off the line

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: Setterz54 ()
Date: May 06, 2018 03:58PM

I have always loved a manual transmission instead of an automatic. Having said that for several reasons Im not as quick to want to drive the manualanymore. My 66 Corsa needs a clutch right now and Im not looking forward to doing it.Once ina while its still nice to get in to a manual transmission vehicle and drive it. I havent totally lost it yet.

Setterz54
Fulton,MD.

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: 66vairman ()
Date: May 06, 2018 04:38PM

kenzen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> When I lived in NYC, manual was a PITA, and my PG
> vair restoration was all about not dealing with
> shifting in traffic all the time. Now that I'm in
> the hills of Maryland, my DD is a S10 2.2 5 speed,
> and I wish the vair was a manual. However,
> putting my kids and dog in the vair, getting milk
> shakes at the local "Arctic Circle", and then
> taking a ride in the back hills is far easier with
> my right hand free to hold the milk shake. smiling smiley
>
> Ken

Those of us in big cities enjoy an automatic daily driver, otherwise stop and go commutes would be even worse to endure.

My weekend cruisers have manual transmissions for fun when I can drive in light traffic or get out of town.

I enjoy driving a good old 4 or 5 speed manual transmission, but the newer six speed manuals have such tight shift patterns they are a PITA to shift in my opinion and I DO NOT like them.

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: glivorsi ()
Date: May 07, 2018 06:15AM

Dale makes a good point about the snow. My Mazdaspeed 6 with AWD and the 6-speed was unstoppable on anything less than about 4". I do miss that part of it. It was good to have in Chicago, but not as necessary in St. Louis. I started a new job since getting the automatic Honda and I now have a longer commute with some pretty heavy traffic light action. I will say that the Mazdaspeed clutch is notoriously awful and very heavy, so a normal manual may have been tolerable.

Greg in Wildwood, MO (part of the St. Louis urban sprawl)

1965 Monza Vert 110PG, Crocus Yellow with black interior and top

2014 Honda Accord V6 (DD)
2017 Honda Pilot (wifemobile)
2012 Chevy Sonic 1.8L (kid's car)
1997 Honda CBR1100XX
2006 Mazdaspeed 6 (no longer own)

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: flamingchariots ()
Date: May 09, 2018 07:26AM

stitch Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Anybody ever meet this guy j3m?
> Would take me a Week to type his comments!



Maybe he uses a talk-to-type machine (like a doctor's office), and then proofreads and makes corrections manually.

Kevin
Medina, OH

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: flamingchariots ()
Date: May 09, 2018 07:32AM

Quote
66vairman
...I enjoy driving a good old 4 or 5 speed manual transmission, but the newer six speed manuals have such tight shift patterns they are a PITA to shift in my opinion and I DO NOT like them.



I agree. My wife's DD is a 6 speed Suzuki SX4. It is fun to drive on occasion, but many times I only use 3 or 4 of the gears, skipping a few as I see fit.





Also: Only a couple manuals in our fleet but I have no problems switching between them, even though I am a two-footed automatic driver, braking with the left foot.

Kevin
Medina, OH

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: Demon-Xanth ()
Date: May 09, 2018 07:40AM

I miss my 4.7+5 speed Dakota. Still eye Dakotas when I see them from my Ram. But there is no way of finding one in Virgnia that would be in the same condition as the one I was bringing back with me from California.

'61 Monza 900, 3 speed. Roams the streets of soon to be Stafford, Va
Cars need to drive to be alive. One that never leaves the garage may be perfect, but dead.

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: ensys ()
Date: May 09, 2018 09:34PM

For me, it depends on the car. The bigger (and more unwieldy), the better to have an auto I think.

What I miss is older, 3 and 4 speed automatics (I specifically exclude 2-speed autos, which I view as just dumb) built on the classic GM Hydramatic model.

Dear Old Dad's '59 Olds had one, and sneaking it out (pre-driver's lic.) in the middle of the nite for practice, was when I learned that one could (and should) "double-clutch" downshifts with an automatic trans. The technique utilizes the momentary pause in a downshift to match-rev the engine before the lower gear engages.

I have used this technique in a wide range of automatics (including a mid-sixties tandem axle dump truck), but most enjoyably in my '84 Supra (with on-demand electric overdrive!). The proof of this puddin' came at 150K mi. when stripped splines on the imput shaft forced a thorough inspection, which I monitored. A direct comparison with new parts revealed no appreciable wear on the clutch bands, a phenomenon I attribute entirely to constant practice of this technique.

Sidebar: It is no coincidence that such techniques offer similar longevity in manual gearbox cluch discs and throwout bearings. I have/had clutch discs with 150K mi. on them without outliving their usefulness, nor have I ever had to replace a disc because of wear, but that's another story.

Sadly, today's autos have taken the fun out of such gearboxes (that have come to contain way too many gears and little inclination to follow orders about gear selection), including executing their own rev matching between gears.

Keep 'em flying...

S.J.Szabo

From America's
Automobile Heartland

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: MonzACT ()
Date: May 13, 2018 05:07AM

I don’t miss a manual gearbox in my DD because it is a 6-speed manual Renault Mégane Sport. No choice. No automatic gearbox was available in the Renault Sport performance models in 2013 when I bought it. I much prefer manuals. I don’t find them a problem in traffic. I just 'automatically' change gears when necessary, often without being consciously aware of it. The new model just released in Europe will have the option of a twin clutch automatic gearbox. I will give that a wide berth, given the problems VW and Ford have had with their twin clutch gearboxes. Bit ironic that both my classic cars (Monza and Rover P5b) are now automatic.

Chris Gallagher
Melbourne, Australia
1964 Monza coupé

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: Mel ()
Date: May 13, 2018 05:15AM

j3m Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I recently bought a new 2018 KIA SOUL. We went to
> eight KIA dealerships and the majority of them
> thought we might have been from Mars since we
> wanted a Manual and would not even look at any
> with an AUTOMATIC. We also wanted the gamma
> engine (smaller displacement-base model). We
> bought it from a KIA dealership that is 90 miles
> away instead of from the local KIA dealerships
> that either priced them too high or didn't have
> any.
>
> Its getting to the point that other than vehicles
> like the SOUL, Honda FIT, NISSAN Versa Sport,
> that it is difficult to find a stick shift. My
> brother bought a new ACURA several years ago
> because they no longer offered the stick or didn't
> carry it in his area's Honda sedans and his
> requirement was leather interior and stick, so he
> had to go ACURA to get that in something built by
> Honda.
> Anybody that still drives a MANUAL like Ford
> Falcon, or seventies era Ford Maverick/Mercury
> Comet with the three on the tree is beyond
> nuts....same thing for old Rambler, Plymouth, GM
> and Studebaker with three on the tree shifting.
> Heck most American car four on the floor shifting
> was AWFUL in the Sixties with some exceptions, the
> Corvair being one of those few exceptions. In
> most instances the horrible 4 on the floor
> shifting in most all Chry/Plymouth, AMC, GM and
> Ford of the sixties is reason enough to choose
> C4/C6 or TH-400, TH-350, or TorqueFlight Automatic
> instead of manual on those particular cars of that
> era.
> There are a few exceptions and most of those
> vehicles are 1967 or 1968 and later vehicles from
> GM/FORD/CHRY-PLYM/AMC. Other than Corvair, there
> aren't any really decent shifting American made
> four on the floors before about the 1967 model
> year. Sure there are certainly dependable and
> solid Borg Warner 4 speeds that were seen in a
> great many vehicles prior to 1967 but to describe
> the shift linkeage and clutch feel as "good" is
> really stretching the truth.....one only has to
> experience a 1965/1966 Mustang or a mid sixties
> Stingray to know that.
> The shifters and their linkeage/clutch feel in say
> a 1963 Ford Galaxie or 1961 Chevy Impala or other
> large car of that era is beyond horrible and
> nowhere near good on its best day. My fellow golf
> team-mate back in college bought a 1967 Impala
> convertible in marina blue with 4 speed and the
> base 327/or 307. He bought it used when it was
> almost two years old. It shifted much better
> than anything from 1965 or before. The damn
> craziest thing was that the car had a factory
> chrome plated steel Gear Shift Ball with the four
> speed pattern. It would BURN your hand if you
> touched it after the car had been sitting with the
> top down in a parking lot without trees or shade
> during MAY-OCT. He never changed out the chrome
> knob but always covered the knob with an old golf
> glove while the top was left down, otherwise in
> the summer, it would get too hot to touch. It
> makes you wonder who the dang genius was that
> specified Chrome gearshift knobs.....cool maybe to
> look at in a photograph but in real use, it is
> just beyond stupid. That was a nice car, his 1967
> and it was extremely dependable and was a huge
> improvement in ride quality/steering/braking over
> the 1964 and earlier full sized Chevys and full
> sized Fords of 1964 & earlier, as 1965 marked huge
> improvements in both with new frames. Cars
> continued to evolve with better engineering in
> some areas even if the Detroit dunces were largely
> asleep at the wheel with overall product quality
> for many products for the next forty five years.
> By 1966 GM with the TH-400 transmission was
> building the best automatic transmission,
> equalled in quality/durability only by the
> Torqueflite by Chrysler. Even the lesser quality
> GM trannies and those from FORD from about the
> 1966 model year onward are durable enough for
> their prescribed applications that choosing the
> manual tranny option to avoid automatic
> transmission repair hassles became a thing of the
> past. The AUTOMATIC tranny in most all
> GM/FORD/CHRYSLER/AMC products from 1967 were
> reliable to bulletproof so that ended any need one
> might have had to go for Manual transmission for
> durabilty/longer life. That certainly was not
> the case before about 1965 or 1966. There were
> AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION REPAIR shops on every
> street corner in the commercial/industrial area of
> towns because most auto trannies weren't long
> lived or extremely reliable before that time, even
> though they had been in the marketplace since
> 1948/1949. It is odd in a way that right at the
> same time that AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSIONS became
> supremely reliable, four on the floor manual
> transmission shifter linkeage/clutch operations
> began to improve somewhat. Maybe only the
> ITALIANS were offering 5 speed in about 1966. The
> Japanese would follow the Europeans and have five
> speeds by 1975 in transmissions that shifted with
> more precision than anything European.
> Domestically, GM, FORD, and Chrysler essentially
> gave up on manual transmission improvement before
> the Pinto and Vega arrived. GM's European
> operations, Vauxhall and Opel did continue to
> evolve the manual as well as autobox for smaller
> cars, as did Ford of Europe. The domestic big 3
> offerings in manual trannies back then was
> horrible in quality and selection compared to
> their European subsidiary operations' offerings
> around the globe.
> Today though when you can find said car equipped
> with MANUAL TRANNY, you need not worry about the
> shift quality as every domestic car today has it's
> best global engineering............it isn't like
> the days of PINTO VEGA, Chevy Monza, Olds
> Starfire, Pontiac Sunbird when it was absolute
> garbage compared to the quality of a Datsun B-210
> or Toyota Corolla, or Mazda GLC.
>
> Lets not even talk about manual shifting in
> American pickup trucks before 30 years ago.
> Quality was nowhere to be found and the big three
> didn't care about improving Manual shifting in
> pickup trucks as they had other much more serious
> self inflicted problems of quality/durabilty in
> every area of product development and products
> that were in the marketplace being about six model
> years behind the Japanese at that time.
>
> IF YOU CAN FIND A MANUAL TRANNY CAR TODAY AT YOUR
> LOCAL DEALERSHIPS, THERE IS NO ISSUE WITH SHIFT
> QUALITY OR CLUTCH FEEL ON DOMESTIC AMERICAN
> VEHICLES AS THERE ONCE WAS, NOT TOO LONG AGO, WHEN
> THE BIG THREE MADE ONLY CRAP. I will say this
> that you've got to be extremely selective when
> choosing anything built and engineered by the big
> three in Detroit before 2007. Detroit built
> 2007 and earlier is largely garbage compared to
> all Asian nameplate makes from the same year. The
> Asian makes' engineering was light-years ahead
> better for at least forty years, and they still
> are second to no one, though Detroit is building
> quality products once again which are at least as
> good as the best quality of the better European
> makes. Manual tranny cars are even more rare
> than station wagons it seems. If you can find
> anything Detroit engineered and built from 2010 or
> newer, you have nothing to worry about as they are
> most all quality products. Finding a stick shift
> in anything 2010 or newer is tough to do.
> With Asian make nameplates, you can go older than
> 2010 but you're absolutely crazy to do that with
> domestic cars or almost all European cars if you
> want a nice reliable automobile that remains
> trouble free and reliable beyond the 100,000 mile
> mark.........most Asian nameplates will provide
> 200,000 to 230,000 while Detroit and European
> makes drop dead at 110,000 miles. It isn't
> uncommon for Detroit makes of a dozen years ago to
> have severe problems before 80,000 miles. You
> have to consider the fact of whether you are
> buying a known piece of junk or not, and for many
> many years there was almost nothing worse than a
> car with a GM/FORD/CHRYSLER emblem on it that was
> engineered in Motown with few exceptions like
> Crown Vics and certain p/u trucks and certain
> truck based SUV's. Almost zero of those
> acceptable quality Detroit products of that time
> were made with manual trannies. Newer Detroit
> offerings do remain troublefree for many thousand
> more miles, better now than all the European makes
> and probably about eighty-five to ninety-three
> percent of what the Asian makes provide in total
> miles. That is a huge improvement over just ten
> or eleven years ago.
> If you want a quality vehicle, today's vehicles
> are the best that the world has ever known. The
> good old days is just hogwash bull feces!
> Unfortunately more than a decade has past since
> the days when MANUAL was largely obtainable.


X2 what j3m said

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: American Mel ()
Date: May 13, 2018 10:15PM

Mel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> X2 what j3m said


You actually spend valuable time reading his epics ? ! ? ! ? ! ?

.
-----------------------------------------------
WA. state, 1 mile south of the Canadian border,
I am not at the end of the world, but you can see it from here.
'66 Monza Coupe - 4spd, 140 Daily driver beater
'67 Monza Vert. - PG, 140 Daily driver beater

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: flamingchariots ()
Date: May 14, 2018 12:46PM

American Mel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Mel Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > X2 what j3m said
>
>
> You actually spend valuable time reading his epics
> ? ! ? ! ? ! ?

=====================================================


Actually I did, too (after Mel posted it).

You know what? He's pretty accurate!

The only thing I would add is that base level Subaru Foresters are currently available with manual, although that may change next year.

Kevin
Medina, OH

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: Seth Emerson ()
Date: May 14, 2018 01:05PM

I split my "non-Corvair" daily driving between a 6-speed Corvette and a Chevy avalanche (Auto). All my Corvairs are 4-speeds. Street and race. For any drivers/sports car, with an automatic, the driver is just a passenger - in the wrong seat.

Seth Emerson

Check my new Performance Corvair Web site [www.perfvair.com]

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: Gregory_Miller ()
Date: May 14, 2018 02:15PM

I miss not having a 5th gear in my Corvair... DD is a 5 speed but the auto was nice to have while nursing a sore left Achilles tendon.

Greg Miller
Eugene, Oregon

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: chris ()
Date: May 14, 2018 02:16PM

On my 2013 Hyundai with a 6 speed manual, I actually wish I had an automatic even though I'm a big fan of manuals. The gear box is good but the clutch/accelerator action leaves much to be desired. Greg, I'll agree with you on the Mazdaspeed clutch; the ones I've driven seemed to be like an on/off switch!

'65 Monza 4 door
4 speed
110hp
Gardner, KS

Heart of America Corvair Owners Association

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Re: OT Anyone Miss Manual Trans in their Daily Drivers?
Posted by: VairKing ()
Date: May 14, 2018 06:40PM

One of our DD cars is a 14 Honda Accord 4cyl 6 speed manual. Although not the most powerful car, it is faster than most Corvairs and is somewhat sporty to drive. The clutch is light and easy to use, and the 6 speed shifter is exact and tight.

_________________________________________
Ryan Counterman (Moderator)
1965 Corsa Kelmark V8 400 HP ///1965 Monza Sedan 110/PG /// Ultimate Corvair Hauler/// Don Eichstaedt's 1965 Corsa Racecar
West Michigan Corvair Club /// New Build! 1966 Corsa GTP Convertible Mid Engine 3.8L Supercharged!

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