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No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: livingthepast ()
Date: October 21, 2017 07:22AM

Hello all,

Still new, getting caught up after another deployment. I've been working on my 63 Spyder as I can this summer. My father-in-law rebuilt it about 12 years ago and I'm having to do some needed updates. He hand made the engine wiring harness so I had to replace it with one from Clarks. Before I started, it ran extremely well, with the caveat fuel was gushing out of the air cleaner and it was stalling in high temps until cool down. I replaced the carb with a carbmeister rebuild, changed the fuel filter, added a fuel bypass, replaced the harness, cap, rotor, plugs, wires, and coil. It now fires immediately and dies. Gas pedal has no effect on keeping it running. I've adjusted the points which resulted in a 20 second extremely rough run and now returned to fire/die. I can't figure out how to test the coil and the numbers coming off multimeter fluxuate. I get generally a 6-7 out of the yellow feed to the coil positive from the starter and 0-12 from the brown line (hot). The black line on the replacement seems to be the tach. It ran before I replaced the harness and did the tune up. I'm thinking of replacing the coil. Sorry about the long-rambling description, but would appreciate any tips. I'm going to pull the plugs and recheck the gaps. Other than that, I'm clueless.

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: American Mel ()
Date: October 21, 2017 08:42AM

Welcome!
There are some really guys on here that are really great at long-distance diagnostics!
I am sure that they will chime in here soon and get you all straightened out.
While waiting for them to chime-in, why not tell us where you are.
One of them may be near to you!
Are you a member of a local club?

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: jjohnsonjo ()
Date: October 21, 2017 09:24AM

Before you do anything else, double or even triple check your spark plug wires for correct positions and make certain #1 is going to #1 one on the distributor. I no this may sound insulting, but almost all of us have screwed this up at one time or another.

J.O.

65 Corsa Turbo Vert
79 Honda XL 500S
69 Honda CL 160 D
2010 BMW F 650 GS
2003 Bounder 36D
2013 KIA Optima SX turbo-AKA ZIPPY (wife,s car)
69 Newport Holiday Sailboat
Baja 150 dune buggy cart
Coleman HS 500 UTV
2016 KIA Sorento SXL Turbo

Bethlehem,Pa

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: livingthepast ()
Date: October 21, 2017 10:01AM

Thanks JO, no insult taken. I'm good with going over everything all over again.

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: livingthepast ()
Date: October 21, 2017 10:09AM

As requested. I originally posted pre-surprise deployment in June. The local folks have reached out to me and I'm trying to get to their next meeting. I inherited a 1963 Corvair Spyder conv. all original minus the paint job. Originally white exterior, father-in-law went with black. Everything else is factory. Thanks to info on this site, all numbers/plates match up. Engine made in March 63, Body plate Sept 63. Has proper Spyder trim/numbers.

When I took over keeping her alive and well in 2015. Did some basic maintenance on it, updated some minor issues and drove it like crazy. Due to the potential of engine fire, I planned this summer for the updates stated. I know enough to be dangerous on cars but learn easily and often. I also fully embrace my ignorance and appreciate all of you here and your willingness to keep Corvairs alive and well. FYI> I'm just outside of Baltimore, MD.

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: RobertC ()
Date: October 21, 2017 10:24AM

Might want to double check that the wires to the + / - post on the coil are correct.

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: livingthepast ()
Date: October 21, 2017 12:05PM

The engine harness has the yellow from the starter, a brown and a black. No instructions. I called both Clarks and the harness manufacturer. They believe it should be the brown wire and that I don't need the ballast resistor. I have yellow and brown to +, black and points to -. I've tested the black and it has shown little movement on the multimeter. The brown has shown up to 12 but tends to fluctuate. I was wondering if maybe the voltage regulator is dying, but have been told these are bullet proof.

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: MattNall ()
Date: October 21, 2017 12:17PM

What you describe and the voltage fluctuations are CORRECT!! MOVE on!

Do you have spark at the coil's wire when it is held 1/4" from metal and engine is cranked?





MODERATOR
Sea Mountain, between Charleston Harbor and Coos Bay! SW Oregon Coast
Click HERE for My Website...Click HERE for My TechPages!
..............................110-PG.................................................Webered-Turbo

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: oldqmguy ()
Date: October 21, 2017 01:23PM

This sounds like either a "bad" (or missing) resistor or resistance wire. sad smiley

The Starter Solenoid supplies +12 Volts to the Coil when the engine is being 'started' but when the engine begins to run (starter not engaged) that voltage goes away and the Coil looks for voltage through the resistor.

So engine starts, starter goes off, voltage is removed, engine dies! angry smiley

With your voltmeter turn the Ignition Switch to ON (NOT Start) and measure the voltage at the coil. If the Points are open it should read +12. If the Points are closed it should read around +6 volts.

IF you see NO voltage at the Coil + terminal that is your problem.

Dale cool smiley

Dale E. Smiley CPBE
Life Member The Society of Broadcast Engineers
RETIRED Broadcast Engineer
CERTIFIED CORVAIR NUT
CORSA/Circle City Corvairs/Corvair Performance Group
Avon, Indiana
WB9SFF
1967 4-Door Monza PG!

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: livingthepast ()
Date: October 22, 2017 12:12PM

Thansk Dale, all,

I have no voltage at the coil. I was replacing the tube for the Turbo gauge and pulled the dash so am guessing/hoping that I managed to unplug or misplug the ignition switch. Will check when I come back for air.

Thanks for getting me past the "wth" point!

Brian

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: Joe West ()
Date: October 22, 2017 01:46PM

You have a wire incorrectly installed on the starter solenoid. I had the exact same thing happen when I took one of the wires off the starter solenoid and then hooked it up back up incorrectly. If I recall correctly, there is a wire that gives the coil full power during starting. If you connect it to the wrong starter solenoid terminal, you will get this exact problem.

Joe


1964 Spyder Convertible, Laurinburg North Carolina
Restoration Website: [www.corvairspyder.com]

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: livingthepast ()
Date: October 27, 2017 10:51AM

Thanks all and apologize for the delay. Had Guard weekend. This weekend is all Corvair! I'm replacing my father-in-law's homemade wiring and the very cracked/aged dash harness. So I will have all new harnesses.(ouch btw). I'm going to confirm TDC as my #1 tower aligns with the engine block - 180 from what I've found on the forum. Will align with a compression tester. Also replacing the ballast resistor. Again, appreciate everyone's comments and PMs.

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: jjohnsonjo ()
Date: October 27, 2017 11:20AM

Just stick a piece of tissue paper in the #1 plug hole. It will blow it out when it comes up on compression.

J.O.

65 Corsa Turbo Vert
79 Honda XL 500S
69 Honda CL 160 D
2010 BMW F 650 GS
2003 Bounder 36D
2013 KIA Optima SX turbo-AKA ZIPPY (wife,s car)
69 Newport Holiday Sailboat
Baja 150 dune buggy cart
Coleman HS 500 UTV
2016 KIA Sorento SXL Turbo

Bethlehem,Pa

Image and video hosting by TinyPic

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Re: No start after changing out engine harness/tune up
Posted by: Richard ()
Date: October 27, 2017 12:36PM

>> I know enough to be dangerous on cars but learn easily and often. I also fully embrace my ignorance and appreciate <<

Rule #1, if you are not familiar with automotive systems, never make more than one change at a time. Multiple changes will leave you running in circles, chasing your own tail.

Have you already changed the engine harness or are you going to change the harness.

If it still has the old wiring, BUT you changed the carb and ignition components, the then start trouble shooting the things you have changed since it was last running.

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Good news! For me at least....
Posted by: livingthepast ()
Date: November 15, 2017 01:48PM

Thanks for all the tips. After much troubleshooting, following advice, replacing some homemade harnesses, and adding the "right" ballast resistor, my 63 Spyder starts like a champ. Now for the fun of troubleshooting under the dash as I have a short to ground somewhere. Turn the lights on and the engine dies smiling smiley This is the hobby stress relief I've been searching for!

Thanks again to all.

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Re: Good news! For me at least....
Posted by: MattNall ()
Date: November 15, 2017 02:02PM

Great news!!

Are you sure it's Charging? That's the sign of low Voltage...very typical.

A short would trip the breaker in the headlight switch... not kill the engine.





MODERATOR
Sea Mountain, between Charleston Harbor and Coos Bay! SW Oregon Coast
Click HERE for My Website...Click HERE for My TechPages!
..............................110-PG.................................................Webered-Turbo

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