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Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: 67 airvair ()
Date: May 15, 2017 12:04AM

In answer to Paul's post:

I think when it comes to terminology, the idea is for everyone to be on the same page as everybody else. Otherwise, how would we understand one another? And since certain terms have been assigned by their designers/makers in the auto industry, why not use their terms? That's been my whole point all along.

However, you then get a small group of people with an attitude who have invented terms only they recognize, and expect the rest of the nation to follow them. It's like: "I'm going to call that car (a 2 door sedan) over there a "post" car because me and my buddies can't figure out what it is, but we like that term, and everybody else in the world is going to have to know what we are talking about. Or else!" And heaven help you if you try to educate them. I know, as I've been given nothing but grief so many times, when I'm only trying to educate people.

Then you have the difference between ignorance and stupidity. Ignorance is the lack of knowledge, and as one wag said, we're all ignorant, but just on different subjects. Stupidity, though, is knowing something, but refusing to use the knowledge.

Then you have people, like marketers, who intentionally corrupt the language, as in the case of the word "sedan." Marketers have misused it to designate "only" a 4 door, when in fact the term has never designated the number of doors. We can probably blame Chevy marketers for corrupting the word sedan, when they added the word "sport" and applied "sport sedan" only to Chevy's 4 door hardtops.

You'd think that we, as car enthusiasts, would take pride in displaying our knowledge of everything automotive by using industry standard terms. instead of showing our ignorance (or maybe stupidity) by use of slang. And sometimes even being proud of displaying such slang. Go figure!

But like you say, it's all probably a dead horse issue. People will use slang however they want. It's just that, on the internet (being it gets everywhere), we ought to be talking in terms everyone universally understands. All the more reason for using industry's preset standard terms.

Now let the drubbing begin!

-Mark

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: cnicol ()
Date: May 15, 2017 06:07AM

...Because we all know that GMPD is the anointed source for all words automotive, right?

Craig N. Coeur d'Alene ID.
66 Black Monza 4dr, 4.2L V8 49k
61 Seamist Jade Rampside 140 PG
60 Monza coupe (sold, sniff sniff)
66 Sprint Corsa convt - First car! Re-purchased 43 years later

+17 Tons of parts

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: WhenIm64 ()
Date: May 15, 2017 06:48AM

Causing me to repeat this, which I posted here four years ago...

A ship's captain was dealing with a seaman whose use of incorrect terminology was irritating.

"Sailor," he bellowed, "You had better start using the correct names! It is not a floor, it is a deck. It is not a wall, it is a bulkhead. It is not a staircase, it is a gangway. It is not a bathroom, it is a head. And if you don't start using the correct terminology, I'm going to throw you out one of those little round windows!"

WhyImWhenIm64

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: Phil Dally ()
Date: May 15, 2017 07:13AM

I'm forced to be pedantic...per Webster.

A source even more credible than SCTA-BNI.


[www.merriam-webster.com]

"Definition of air dam: a device attached to the underside of the front of an automobile
to improve stability, aerodynamic performance, by redirecting the flow of air."


edit: syntax



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/15/2017 07:16AM by Phil Dally.

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: cnicol ()
Date: May 15, 2017 07:47AM

As long as we're gettng all huffy about using the exact, correct terms...

From Merriam-Webster:

Definition of valance

1
: a drapery hung along the edge of a bed, table, altar, canopy, or shelf

2
: a short drapery or wood or metal frame used as a decorative heading to conceal the top of curtains and fixtures

Craig sez: I think I know why GM called it a Valance Panel


Valence is a term from chemistry relating to electron availabilty in an atom's electron shell.

Craig N. Coeur d'Alene ID.
66 Black Monza 4dr, 4.2L V8 49k
61 Seamist Jade Rampside 140 PG
60 Monza coupe (sold, sniff sniff)
66 Sprint Corsa convt - First car! Re-purchased 43 years later

+17 Tons of parts




Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/15/2017 07:50AM by cnicol.

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: Wagon Master ()
Date: May 15, 2017 07:48AM

So I'm working on my carbs. and I ask Phil for a Cresent wrench and channel locks. He hands me a pair of vise-grips. I'm stupid and he's just dumb. Cause I know the difference but I'm lazy. He just doesn't know what he doesn't know.
.

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: Phil Dally ()
Date: May 15, 2017 08:04AM

You used my next definition Craig!!

Still no curtains on my racecar...yet.

Was valance an aesthetic description?

Wagon...please hand me that spanner.

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: BobV66Vair ()
Date: May 15, 2017 08:55AM

I happen to agree with Mark about using correct terminology. When I was training to be a mechanic at Ford they only identified things with the terms in the Ford shop manual. It meant that when someone asked you to remove an item you removed the correct part. For Corvair's, I think we should use the nomenclature that GM assigned. I find myself using slang and it usually leads me to refer to the shop manual or parts book because I misidentified a part name. When I ask a question about something on the car, if I use the correct term, I get the correct answer. Webster's is not the authority on GM nomenclature, GM is. We all have slang names for parts, that just happens over time. If we all use the same slang, it works but often it doesn't. I have seen more than one post correcting another posters terminology. That's not being picky, it's allowing others to learn something and speak in a common language. That common language is nomenclature and it does matter. Many trades have their own nomenclature. Although they use the same words, for each the meaning is different. Look at how lawyers speak for examples. Confusing if you don't understand that language but perfectly precise if you do. I will try to be precise in my posts and use the correct GM terminology going forward. I won't be bothered if I make a mistake or if others do. We are here for fun and learning.

Bob Vinnacombe
Sandy, Oregon
1965 Corsa 140 stock
1966 Monza Soon to be race car
1968 Monza Parts for now

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: David Malcolm ()
Date: May 15, 2017 09:04AM

Language is important. When I taught I would insist that data was plural and etc. Of course it all depends on what is being communicated.
I think part of the problem today is you don't need to know what the proper term for something is "just watch the Utube video."
(Love your post Bob)

David Malcolm
1969 Monza PG Coupe
NJ near the Meadowlands

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: JerryM ()
Date: May 15, 2017 10:13AM

Really? I participate in this forum for more important things, like, where can I get a repop dizzy for my restomod moredoor?

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: Murphy ()
Date: May 15, 2017 12:20PM

If you're going to stir the pot, at least pick a topic that hasn't been talked to death!!eye rolling smiley

65 Monza Coupe
61 500 Coupe (under Construction) Getting close.

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: 67 airvair ()
Date: May 15, 2017 07:38PM

At least BobV66Vair and Dave Malcolm get my point. smileys with beer

I'm not trying to stir the pot, beat any dead horse, or so on. Just trying to be understood. But there are always those who take this list too seriously, get their panties in a bunch, and take offense to even the slightest hint of constructive criticism, any effort to educate themselves, or even improve our communications with one another. Like I said, I get beat up every time I say anything that might even hint at the above.eye popping smiley

People just amaze me, for even a simple statement can result in a wide array of reactions. No wonder the Lord made the human race. He was bored with the universe and wanted some diverse conversations and reactions.grinning smiley

I guess the beatings will continue..... eye rolling smiley

As for me, I won't let the naysayers poison the atmosphere, and will just continue to enjoy reading other threads and educating myself on all things Corvair. winking smiley

-Mark

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: BobV66Vair ()
Date: May 15, 2017 10:53PM

I did apologize in advance. I just thought it was interesting to read what GM wrote. I do recall the long thread on this. It got over the top. I was not trying to repeat that, hence my opening statement. I probably should have taken my own advice and not posted.

I like this forum even when there are disagreements. Usually all in good fun but sometimes people feel insulted. I try to control that urge to hurt but don't always achieve it. As Mark said, until moral improves, the beatings will continue. There are not enough of us to lose anyone over some posts.

Bob Vinnacombe
Sandy, Oregon
1965 Corsa 140 stock
1966 Monza Soon to be race car
1968 Monza Parts for now

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: bertle ()
Date: May 16, 2017 02:27AM

You lot should try reading US forums from an Englishman's perspective, you all use the wrong terms to me! I have had to learn to read and type in American while translating in my mind as I go. Doesn't bother me though but is amusing how many differences there are considering we all speak English.

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: 67 airvair ()
Date: May 16, 2017 05:45AM

Bertle, I once heard someone say that at the rate the English, Australian, and American versions of the English language were changing, that in just a couple of hundred years (or less) that we'd need translators just to talk to one another.

And at the rate that Spanish is working into some parts of the U.S. culture, we here on this side of the pond may by then be speaking Spanglish.

Personally, I find the differences between us and you Brits all rather delightful. And I love foreign accents! I even buy foreign movies, undubbed versions only, just to hear how other languages sound.grinning smiley

-Mark

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: cnicol ()
Date: May 16, 2017 06:06AM

Do the British speak with a "foreign accent", or do we?grinning smiley

Craig N. Coeur d'Alene ID.
66 Black Monza 4dr, 4.2L V8 49k
61 Seamist Jade Rampside 140 PG
60 Monza coupe (sold, sniff sniff)
66 Sprint Corsa convt - First car! Re-purchased 43 years later

+17 Tons of parts

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: David Malcolm ()
Date: May 16, 2017 06:57AM

My wife is English--been here over 40 years and still has her accent.
But British auto terms! Had 1950s Hillmans, friends had Morgans and a Morris. Besides the Whitworth hassle there was the joy of trying to figure out the manuals--near side, far side and etc.
I'm sure the net is leading to more fragmentation in groups/language these days. Not good or bad just the way things are going.
(Love this list, learn a lot and of course you don't have to read threads that annoy.)

David Malcolm
1969 Monza PG Coupe
NJ near the Meadowlands



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/16/2017 06:58AM by David Malcolm.

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: Chilly Willy ()
Date: May 16, 2017 08:49AM

There are too many words to describe one part or whatever. We roll with it 😉
No such thing as a dead horse thread. Don't open it or respond 😉
Sometimes here the Atom's Valence is high. That can happen when you stir a dead capacitor. grinning smiley



Will
Northern California

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: BobV66Vair ()
Date: May 16, 2017 09:07AM

I used to get a kick out of Wheeler Dealers as the mechanic described parts and actions. We jamb it into place, Ed offered it up. I can imagine that it is as amusing going the other way. Bertle, spell in English, it will add to the flavor of the forum. It also may spawn some threads on proper terminology, God forbid.

Bob Vinnacombe
Sandy, Oregon
1965 Corsa 140 stock
1966 Monza Soon to be race car
1968 Monza Parts for now

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Re: Terminology, was LM Front Bumper Valence Panel
Posted by: corventure Dave ()
Date: May 16, 2017 10:54AM

This stuff all cracks me up...


Like a Shock is actually a rebound dampener...
And a Spring is actually a shock absorber!

And I still don't know the difference between Catsup and ketchup either!confused smiley

grinning smiley

Corventure Dave

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