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How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: Nickyd510 ()
Date: May 23, 2014 04:28PM

Hi All!

I'm beginning the hunt for an early model Spyder hard-top, and I'm wondering if anyone can give me the quick trick on how to tell if it's truly factory from the tags. The Ideal Garage check-list by Steven Serenska is super helpful but only for late models from what I can tell.

Thank you!
Nick

Nicky D.
1964 110HP 'Vert - "Darla", 1964 Spyder - "Ruby"
Echo Park, Los Angeles, CA


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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: coleslaw31 ()
Date: May 23, 2014 04:36PM

Firstly spyder was 62-63 only

South Carolina Upstate



68 Monza convertible 140 4spd A/C (coming soon)
66 Corsa coupe 140 4spd

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: yrplace17 ()
Date: May 23, 2014 04:36PM

One easy thing to look at is the cutout for the tail pipe on the right rear of the car. A true Spyder has the cutout from the factory, whereas a conversion will have a cutout done during the conversion. Should be easy to spot.

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: Nickyd510 ()
Date: May 23, 2014 04:44PM

Cole, the '64 still had the 150hp turbo engine, with a new larger displacement being the only difference from the 62-63, I think.

yrplace, i think my convertible (monza) has after-market cuts in the back for a dual exhaust system. so you're saying in the turbo there's just one clean cut exhaust in the right side? half-circle?

Nicky D.
1964 110HP 'Vert - "Darla", 1964 Spyder - "Ruby"
Echo Park, Los Angeles, CA





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/23/2014 04:51PM by Nickyd510.

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: vairygood ()
Date: May 23, 2014 04:51PM

Not to be a smart azz coleslaw but why do you say the spyder was 62-63 only?

Buster Tindel
Gulfport Mississippi

65 Corsa 140 4 speed

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: Nickyd510 ()
Date: May 23, 2014 04:53PM

just found this thread: [corvaircenter.com]

"If the first 5 digits of the VIN number are 40667 it's a real Spyder."

Sounds pretty straightforward with that nugget!

Nicky D.
1964 110HP 'Vert - "Darla", 1964 Spyder - "Ruby"
Echo Park, Los Angeles, CA


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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: tkalp ()
Date: May 23, 2014 04:55PM

First three digits of the VIN should be 406. In '64 the Spyder was a separate model. The cutout for the exhaust was Spyder only, it should not be just cut but have a flange to the inside.

T. Kalp
Wichita, KS

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: Nickyd510 ()
Date: May 23, 2014 04:56PM

thanks, t. kalp. good to know!

Nicky D.
1964 110HP 'Vert - "Darla", 1964 Spyder - "Ruby"
Echo Park, Los Angeles, CA


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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: NMCarNut ()
Date: May 23, 2014 05:10PM

As you found a true 64 Spyder is easy to tell from a Monza clone by looking at the serial number. A Spyder serial number will start with 40667 for the convertible and and 40627 for the coupe.
For 62-63 it is a little trickier since the Spyder was an option on the Monza line. So you need to look at the ACC line on the Body Tag. Oakland built Spyders will have an "X" on the ACC line. The other factories (I believe) will have a "D" included in the ACC line in 1962 and a "C" included in the third group of the ACC line for 63. Maybe one of the gurus can verify the letters are correct.

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: coleslaw31 ()
Date: May 23, 2014 05:22PM

I was told it was. I don't mind admitting to being wrong though.

vairygood Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not to be a smart azz coleslaw but why do you say
> the spyder was 62-63 only?

South Carolina Upstate



68 Monza convertible 140 4spd A/C (coming soon)
66 Corsa coupe 140 4spd

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: vairygood ()
Date: May 23, 2014 05:31PM

Don't feel bad,I'm still learning and my first Corvair was a 64 coupe lol

Buster Tindel
Gulfport Mississippi

65 Corsa 140 4 speed

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: Nickshu ()
Date: May 23, 2014 05:54PM

If having an original "numbers matching" car is important to you (as it is to me) here's some notes for 1964 Spyders for you. It's worth verifying this since Corvairs were for many many years not seen as being valuable many people swapped parts/engines/bodies/transmissions, etc with no regard for originality:

Body tag in the engine bay is the place to start:

All 1964 Corvairs were built at Willow Run Ohio, so all '64s have WR on the body tag, no other plants.

Spyders start with "64-06" on the body number as stated above. Convertibles were 40667 (67 meaning convertible).

There is another number in the top left of the body tag that indicates the month and week the car was built. Mine is 09C, which means 09 (September) and C (3rd week, as in A,B,C,D), 1963. 1964 models were built starting September 1963. This may not seem important but IT IS, because this is how you can best tell if the engine and transmission are original to that car and have not been changed.

Engine code - All Spyder's 1962,63,64 use engine codes that end with YR. This code is found on the engine case near the oil filler tube. This code also includes a date in it. For example mine is T09I4YR, which means it's a Spyder engine (YR) that was built on 9/14. This would correspond to the body build date of 3rd week September (09C) so the engine was made the week before the car, and is most likely original to that car. There is one problem with Spyders, they all had YR codes, 1962,63,64. You know that the 1964's were a different engine increased to 164CID but they used the same YR codes. You have to check the cylinder head numbers to be sure, which requires you to remove two bolts of the engine shroud at the driver's front corner and two more at the passenger's rear corner of the cyl heads, pry the shroud back and check the head codes. '64 Spyder 164CID cyl head codes are 3819904. Check these to be sure.

Transaxle casting code - On the driver's side of the diff case, bottom lip area. This shows the casting date of the transaxle. Mine is I43, which means it was cast in month "I" which is September (A=Jan, B=Feb, etc), on the 4th day, 1963. This matches the 09C build date of my car and is likely original to the car, since the transaxle was cast and assembled on or shortly after 9/4/1963 and my car was built in the 3rd week of September (09C, again). Also if you see "HJ" stamped nearby it means it's a factory Positraction differential.

The above will show you body/driveline matching numbers, relatively. There is no corresponding numbers so the only way to tell is to corroborate the build dates.

The Carter YH carb for 1964 should have stamped on the top near the bowl cover the number "0-1580". If it has been changed for a 180HP carb the numbers are 1769 or 1750.

The turbo should have P/N 3831691. If it has been changed for a 180HP turbo the numbers are different.

The distributor should have the number 1110314 on it for a 1964 turbo distributor.

The VIN number should match the body tag, it's on the driver's door jamb...the VIN starts with the first numbers on the body tag, as in 64-06xxxxxxxxx. There's a hidden VIN number stamped into the body on the pinch weld driver's side front suspension area, unfortunately you have to remove the front suspension crossmember to see it.

Hope this helps!!

Nick
_______________________________________________________________________
1964 Monza Spyder Convertible #435 - Rotisserie restored - SOLD ON BRING A TRAILER 4/30/2019 - Check out my restoration thread here: [corvaircenter.com]
Thanks to all the awesome CCF, CF, COG, and CORSA members who helped me with the restoration!
Other fun stuff - Porsche 911 GT3 - Trailered track monster for HPDE and Autocross events.
Northern Colorado, USA



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/23/2014 06:01PM by Nickshu.

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: yrplace17 ()
Date: May 23, 2014 05:55PM

Nickyd510 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cole, the '64 still had the 150hp turbo engine,
> with a new larger displacement being the only
> difference from the 62-63, I think.
>
> yrplace, i think my convertible (monza) has
> after-market cuts in the back for a dual exhaust
> system. so you're saying in the turbo there's
> just one clean cut exhaust in the right side?
> half-circle?


Yes. I was assuming that you couldn't get the correct VIN from the car.That would tell you exactly what the car was......

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: ccpinc ()
Date: May 23, 2014 07:41PM

All 1962-64 Spyders have an overheat warning buzzer mounted up under the dash against the bulkhead near the lower windshield on the LH side. The fuse block harness has a special accomodation for this buzzer. The buzzer looks like a horn relay (silver). If someone is faking a Spyder they'd would have had to install a true Spyder fuse block wiring harness to have the buzzer. However, if they did, it would likely be missing the black plastic retaining strap.

[www.californiacorvairparts.com]


CALIFORNIA CORVAIR PARTS

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: vairmech ()
Date: May 23, 2014 08:04PM

With everything said above, the very first and easiest thing to look at is the tail pipe cutout. EVERY FACTORY Spyder had the flange of sheet metal around the opening. I have seen some very good looking cut outs that were put there but were not factory because they did not have that flange stamped in. This would be the first thing I would look at because tags can be swapped and hard to tell if they were changed and done correctly, although most don't. The one thing that could happen is someone has a real Spyder, the rear is damaged/rusted and they can only find a regular car rear panel and the bodyshop just cuts the opening.

If the muffler cutout has the flange and you want to start getting picky then start looking at the numbers. As has been said 62-63 the Spyder was an OPTION meaning it did ot have it's own VIN designation just a letter in the options line of the body tag. 1964 the Spyder was given it's own VIN designation but was still in the option line on the body tag.

Ken Hand
Handy Car Care
248 613 8586

Vairmech@aol.com

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: Chris Lampe ()
Date: May 23, 2014 08:41PM

Nickshu Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> All 1964 Corvairs were built at Willow Run Ohio,
> so all '64s have WR on the body tag, no other
> plants.
>
>

Not trying to be a horse's hinney here, But Willow Run is in Michigan, not Ohio.

Just trying to help educate in case anyone did not know the history of the Corvair.

Willow Run is in Ypsilanti Michigan where Corvairs were built from 1959-1969.

Chris
Rowlett, Tx
NTCA - North Texas Corvair Association
CORSA
'64 Monza 'vert

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: Nickshu ()
Date: May 24, 2014 06:11AM

My mistake... Michigan.

Nick
_______________________________________________________________________
1964 Monza Spyder Convertible #435 - Rotisserie restored - SOLD ON BRING A TRAILER 4/30/2019 - Check out my restoration thread here: [corvaircenter.com]
Thanks to all the awesome CCF, CF, COG, and CORSA members who helped me with the restoration!
Other fun stuff - Porsche 911 GT3 - Trailered track monster for HPDE and Autocross events.
Northern Colorado, USA

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Re: How to tell 1964 true Spyder?
Posted by: Nickyd510 ()
Date: May 24, 2014 10:21AM

This is all so incredibly helpful - thank you everyone for your input I feel really well educated.

@Nickshu - that's a pro lesson on all the number variables and super interesting - thank you for the thorough run-down!

I'm checking one out today and I'll let you guys know how it goes!

Thanks,
Nicky D.

Nicky D.
1964 110HP 'Vert - "Darla", 1964 Spyder - "Ruby"
Echo Park, Los Angeles, CA


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