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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: Nickshu ()
Date: February 10, 2016 03:32PM

bmarsh52 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Maybe its the angle of the photos but it looks to
> me like the fork is not engaged in the groove of
> the TOB in the first two photos. Looks like it's
> behind the flange on the diff side.


It's engaged correctly, of that I am sure. I checked that multiple times before assembling to be sure b/c I know it's an issue.

Nick
_______________________________________________________________________
1964 Monza Spyder Convertible #435 - Rotisserie restored - SOLD ON BRING A TRAILER 4/30/2019 - Check out my restoration thread here: [corvaircenter.com]
Thanks to all the awesome CCF, CF, COG, and CORSA members who helped me with the restoration!
Other fun stuff - Porsche 911 GT3 - Trailered track monster for HPDE and Autocross events.
Northern Colorado, USA

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: vairmech ()
Date: February 10, 2016 05:50PM

The riveted disc you see is not a stock disc at all, it is a HP aftermarket Carbon Kevlar disc. When I started carrying these I checked for rivet clearance before I ever purchased one. There are several of these types of discs in other cars without the issue of the rivets hitting. As I told Nick I didn't actually measure the disc thickness and while it looked close to being correct the actual measurement will tell one of the tales. The only other unknown is if I kept the correct flywheel step depth. Those items and the pilot bushing depth are pretty much what is in question and need to be checked.

Ken Hand
Handy Car Care
248 613 8586

Vairmech@aol.com

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: v8vair ()
Date: February 11, 2016 05:43AM

I ran into this on my V8. I put a new disc in and the clutch dragged, Wouldnt go in reverse unless i shut it off. I jacked it up and in gear I had Eli press the clutch and i couldnt spin the wheels. Since all i did was change the disc i was sure that was the issue. It turn out to maybe ..020 thicker. You might also check the throw out brg fork,Flexing? I know the HD presure plates take a lot of pedal effort. Mike

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: v8vair ()
Date: February 11, 2016 03:38PM

Clarks claims the correct thickness for the disc is .280-.300 the .300-.320 can cause drag. hope this helps mike

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: davemotohead ()
Date: February 11, 2016 03:49PM

Also I believe the Pivot ball Height is different between the Early clutch and late clutch set up, I am going with Steve and Mike on this one, either the rivets are hitting or the disc is too thick, also the ball might be wrong making it worse? I have had a few over the years that I had to burn in to get them to loosen up.







1960 4dr sedan caveman car
1961 Rampside (Chetside)
1962 Rampside (Barnside)
1962 Short Rampside (Shortside)
1962 Monza 700 Wagon
1963 Monza 900 coup (General Nader)

-----------------------------------
Rust Free Lancaster Ca

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: gerg ()
Date: February 11, 2016 03:57PM

I have a very similar issue with my rampside. The clutch works just off the floor, and I have the cable a little bit tighter than the adjustment procedure calls for. I have heard others had a similar issue, but I did put a late flywheel clutch and cover up against an early differential. Pretty sure I have the right pivot ball and throw out bearing, but I'm going to pull it apart at some point to verify.

gerg
Monroe, LA


1965 500 Coupe, 140hp / PG, Brown EFI - work in progress
1962 Rampside, 110Hp, factory 4 speed & 3.89 posi


Current cars and other fun stuff -> [gregblakeney.smugmug.com]

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: RexJohnson ()
Date: February 13, 2016 09:25AM

To check and see if the piolet bushing is set deep enough into the crank remove the front cover off of the trans. Drop the drive train in the front and remove the trans crossmember and with the cover removed check the clearance between the input shaft and the snap ring in the center of the clutch gear. If the piolet is deep enough there should be a little space between the snap ring and the shaft. Make sure that the clutch gear and bearing are held tight against the front of the trans when making this check. If it is to tight use what ever it takes to tap the shaft forward to move the piolet bushing forward. Be careful not to damage the snap ring in the end of the gear.

RJ tools
Salem,Oregon

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: Nickshu ()
Date: February 13, 2016 05:33PM

Ok guys, I pulled the engine and investigated the clutch today. The pilot bushing was 1/8" from the face of the crank, but still had another 1/8" to go to be seated against the stop inside the crank. I think this was my problem. So much for following the shop manual!

I pulled the PP and flywheel and bench tested it on my press. It disengages easily w/ less than 1/4" travel. The disc measured just under 0.330".

There is PLENTY of clearance between the flywheel bolts and the rivets on the special carbon/Kevlar clutch disc Ken Hand supplied.

I'll try to get it back in the car tomorrow if I have time.

Nick
_______________________________________________________________________
1964 Monza Spyder Convertible #435 - Rotisserie restored - SOLD ON BRING A TRAILER 4/30/2019 - Check out my restoration thread here: [corvaircenter.com]
Thanks to all the awesome CCF, CF, COG, and CORSA members who helped me with the restoration!
Other fun stuff - Porsche 911 GT3 - Trailered track monster for HPDE and Autocross events.
Northern Colorado, USA



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/13/2016 05:34PM by Nickshu.

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: davemotohead ()
Date: February 13, 2016 05:49PM

Do you have a EM or LM bell housing? I have never had to drive the pilot bushing in all the way, Have always counter sunk them 1/8 from the face like the manual says, all the stock ones I have removed have been the 1/8 as well.







1960 4dr sedan caveman car
1961 Rampside (Chetside)
1962 Rampside (Barnside)
1962 Short Rampside (Shortside)
1962 Monza 700 Wagon
1963 Monza 900 coup (General Nader)

-----------------------------------
Rust Free Lancaster Ca

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: Nickshu ()
Date: February 13, 2016 08:26PM

EM Dave. You could see where it was rubbing once apart. NOS 64 input shaft.

Nick
_______________________________________________________________________
1964 Monza Spyder Convertible #435 - Rotisserie restored - SOLD ON BRING A TRAILER 4/30/2019 - Check out my restoration thread here: [corvaircenter.com]
Thanks to all the awesome CCF, CF, COG, and CORSA members who helped me with the restoration!
Other fun stuff - Porsche 911 GT3 - Trailered track monster for HPDE and Autocross events.
Northern Colorado, USA

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: 63turbo ()
Date: February 14, 2016 08:02AM

Nick- I remembered that I had the same problem you are having when I switched
to that style of throw out bearing. I have a late heavy duty pressure plate, late flywheel 64-65 transmission, late style pivot ball, late bell housing installed in my early. At that time I also put in a new disk, and couldn't understand why it wouldn't release fully. After checking the heights of the new T.O. bearing vs the stock late one, I found that the new one, which is a constant contact type, is shorter than stock late one and therefore the shop manual adjustment procedure for the clutch cable rotator (the thing that pulls on the throw out bearing fork rod) just does not work! You have to re-adjust that rotator for maximum throw- so the rotator has to be set just short of hitting the transmission mount, and no slack in the cable- this will cause the throw-out bearing to be touching the pressure plate fingers at all times, which is how they are intended to be used. It might work out better to add a spacer under the pivot ball to compensate for the shorter throw-out bearing but
I have no idea how thick it would need to be, and I didn't take care of that problem that way- in other words I didn't test it. Basically though the problem
is that the fork isn't quite moving far enough towards the pressure plate to fully release, and the problem is compounded by the extra thickness of your new clutch plate.
Hope this helps!

------------------------------------

Kevin Nash
Friday Harbor Washington
63 Spyder, Daily driver, EFI read about my project here: [corvaircenter.com]
first test start on EFI here:[www.youtube.com]
first official EFI boost test here:[www.youtube.com]
My new fan! [corvaircenter.com]
engine less 62 Spyder
Canadian 64 Monza Parts car



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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: Mel ()
Date: February 14, 2016 08:12AM

63turbo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nick- I remembered that I had the same problem you
> are having when I switched
> to that style of throw out bearing. I have a late
> heavy duty pressure plate, late flywheel 64-65
> transmission, late style pivot ball, late bell
> housing installed in my early. At that time I also
> put in a new disk, and couldn't understand why it
> wouldn't release fully. After checking the heights
> of the new T.O. bearing vs the stock late one, I
> found that the new one, which is a constant
> contact type, is shorter than stock late one and
> therefore the shop manual adjustment procedure for
> the clutch cable rotator (the thing that pulls on
> the throw out bearing fork rod) just does not
> work! You have to re-adjust that rotator for
> maximum throw- so the rotator has to be set just
> short of hitting the transmission mount, and no
> slack in the cable- this will cause the throw-out
> bearing to be touching the pressure plate fingers
> at all times, which is how they are intended to be
> used. It might work out better to add a spacer
> under the pivot ball to compensate for the shorter
> throw-out bearing but
> I have no idea how thick it would need to be, and
> I didn't take care of that problem that way- in
> other words I didn't test it. Basically though the
> problem
> is that the fork isn't quite moving far enough
> towards the pressure plate to fully release, and
> the problem is compounded by the extra thickness
> of your new clutch plate.
> Hope this helps!


That explanation sounds like if you use the correct TO bearing the clutch will release properly???Humconfused smiley I can't really agree about the TO bearing always being in contact with Belleville spring confused smiley

Orangeville, Ontario. CANADA



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/14/2016 08:20AM by Mel.

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: 63turbo ()
Date: February 14, 2016 08:27AM

The newer type of throw out bearing is a much nicer, longer lasting unit, I've put 50,000 to 60,000 miles on that bearing set-up just like I described with no
issues at all with the fingers being in contact with the bearing- works just fine, and would never go back to the old style bearing- I've thoroughly tested this set-up. To each his own though.

------------------------------------

Kevin Nash
Friday Harbor Washington
63 Spyder, Daily driver, EFI read about my project here: [corvaircenter.com]
first test start on EFI here:[www.youtube.com]
first official EFI boost test here:[www.youtube.com]
My new fan! [corvaircenter.com]
engine less 62 Spyder
Canadian 64 Monza Parts car



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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: Nickshu ()
Date: February 14, 2016 02:30PM

Unipack is back in the car. Clutch working great now!

Nick
_______________________________________________________________________
1964 Monza Spyder Convertible #435 - Rotisserie restored - SOLD ON BRING A TRAILER 4/30/2019 - Check out my restoration thread here: [corvaircenter.com]
Thanks to all the awesome CCF, CF, COG, and CORSA members who helped me with the restoration!
Other fun stuff - Porsche 911 GT3 - Trailered track monster for HPDE and Autocross events.
Northern Colorado, USA

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: Mel ()
Date: February 14, 2016 02:31PM

Excellent thumbs up

Orangeville, Ontario. CANADA

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: The Stig ()
Date: February 14, 2016 03:03PM

Great news!

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: MattNall ()
Date: February 14, 2016 03:07PM

Glad to hear that!

MODERATOR
Sea Mountain, between Charleston Harbor and Coos Bay! SW Oregon Coast
Click HERE for My Website...Click HERE for My TechPages!
..............................110-PG.................................................Webered-Turbo

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: guy63 ()
Date: February 15, 2016 08:10AM

Carry on!smileys with beer

Guy
63 Spyder Coupe
Minnetonka, MN, but soon to be Harrisville, NH
<img src=http://corvaircenter.com/phorum/file.php?1,file=142718,filename=19577529_1908805572676603_5068088240259900211_osmall.jpg>

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: Nickshu ()
Date: February 20, 2016 05:56PM

Setup alignment today w/ the Tenhulzen kit. Worked really slick. Took a couple times to get used to. I actually set toe first b/c I wanted to know how far out I was, then I went back again and set Caster, then Camber, then Toe.

I set the rear at 1/16" toe and was able to get it even on both sides. I anticipate as the springs settle and weight is added this number will increase.

Front came in at 2 deg caster, 0 deg camber, 5/16" toe. I expect camber to increase as those springs settle too.

**The string trolly is actually backwards, the feet go towards the tires, not away...note I put boards on them so they would not tip, after the photo was taken I realized I had them backwards, with the feet going towards the car it offsets the string tension.





Nick
_______________________________________________________________________
1964 Monza Spyder Convertible #435 - Rotisserie restored - SOLD ON BRING A TRAILER 4/30/2019 - Check out my restoration thread here: [corvaircenter.com]
Thanks to all the awesome CCF, CF, COG, and CORSA members who helped me with the restoration!
Other fun stuff - Porsche 911 GT3 - Trailered track monster for HPDE and Autocross events.
Northern Colorado, USA



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/20/2016 05:58PM by Nickshu.

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Re: Nickshu's '64 Spyder Restoration Thread
Posted by: junkman ()
Date: February 21, 2016 11:28AM

I am wondering how you set the rear alignment. Could you please post the process? thanks Junk..

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