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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: irfgt ()
Date: May 03, 2018 05:36PM

This thread seems to me to be a bash Automotive Technician thread. Most Technicians were not even born when Corvairs roamed the neighborhoods. For someone to become proficient on a vehicle that will probably never grace the Shop doors makes no sense either. Making fun of Technicians for being parts changers is also not necessarily true either any more because parts are simply not offered for most assemblies such as starters and alternators and even if they were there are so many variations that no one could afford to warehouse them. Plus at over $100.00 per hour for labor rules out many repairs. Just as the newer Technicians don't know much about older cars most older people don't know much about the newer cars. Knocking someone or their employer serves no purpose because every era has its superlatives.

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: American Mel ()
Date: May 04, 2018 08:31AM

Unfortunately, the current era has very few "Superlatives"!
While I don't think members here are trying to "Bash" Service Techs, I think what most people are trying to convey, is that there is a HUGE difference between real MECHANICS and Technicians!
A Modern Service Tech relies on a computer to tell him what is wrong with a car,
while a Mechanic 3/4 of the time has an innate ability to listen to a vehicle as it pulls up at the street, and recognizes what is wrong with it.
It is hard to do that with a modern computer controlled car today, because the computers tend to compensate for some issues and mask the problems by adjusting things.

.
-----------------------------------------------
WA. state, 1 mile south of the Canadian border,
I am not at the end of the world, but you can see it from here.
'66 Monza Coupe - 4spd, 140 Daily driver beater
'67 Monza Vert. - PG, 140 Daily driver beater

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: Brizo ()
Date: May 04, 2018 11:29AM

American Mel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Unfortunately, the current era has very few
> "Superlatives"!
> While I don't think members here are trying to
> "Bash" Service Techs, I think what most people are
> trying to convey, is that there is a HUGE
> difference between real MECHANICS and
> Technicians!
> A Modern Service Tech relies on a computer to tell
> him what is wrong with a car,
> while a Mechanic 3/4 of the time has an innate
> ability to listen to a vehicle as it pulls up at
> the street, and recognizes what is wrong with it.
> It is hard to do that with a modern computer
> controlled car today, because the computers tend
> to compensate for some issues and mask the
> problems by adjusting things.

Actually, its rare for a diagnostic scan to give a code that tells exactly what's wrong. The trouble code may tell you what system the problem is in, then the tech must study the data for that system, do a through check for related service bulletins, and probably run a few tests and a visual inspection before deciding on a cause.

Dan Brizendine,
'64 8door Greenbrier 140 PG. "In beautiful Wanamaker Indiana...with one stop light and 5 pizza shops"

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: irfgt ()
Date: May 04, 2018 12:20PM

A modern Technician HAS to rely on on board diagnostics and computer testing because that's how the vehicle operates. Almost every system on a vehicle is controlled by an on board computer. Our old Corvairs are purely mechanical marvels and in very few ways resemble today's vehicles. If you all will notice, many Corvair owners are converting their Corvairs over to todays electronic marvels including complete drivetrain replacement. Just drive down the highways and you rarely see a disabled vehicle especially with the traffic count we have today. Don't knock the new guys for not knowing about the old stuff because that's not where their income comes from. By the way, I'm an ASE Master Technician and have been since its inception in 1974. I've been there and am still there.

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: Frank DuVal ()
Date: May 04, 2018 08:58PM

What? Eldon, MO is near Oklahoma City? confused smiley

I am familiar with The Carburetor Shop of Eldon, MO for old car carburetor repairs and kits. He posts on the AACA forum a lot.

I see, there is another business called the Carburetor Shop right there in Oklahoma City!thumbs up

Frank DuVal

Fredericksburg, VA

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: playerpage ()
Date: May 05, 2018 07:56AM

Since I resurrected this thread I will defend it and say this was never about bashing techs, not really. At least not the way I read it. It was more about looking for fun reactions if people did it.

Eric C. Player
Porterville, CA
- National Member, CORSA
- Member: Central Coast CORSA & South Coast CORSA
Former Member: Vintage CORSA Orange County. Member, ISA (Int. Screenwriter's Assn.), SAG Eligible, and Producer's Guild Aspirant


* Then: 1966 Corsa 180 Turbo, Red/1965 Monza 110 Purple/
1967 Monza 140 Red/1966 500 110 Black/1965 Monza 110 Yellow
* Now: 1966 Corsa 180 Turbo Project. Blue, Blue/Beige interior.



"Chevrolet's Corvair was a maverick machine, a rear-engined renegade born out of spite and genius." -- Sports Car Graphic, August 1969

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: jmaechtlen ()
Date: May 05, 2018 10:37AM

It is neat that some dealerships are able to support at least some of the now aging vehicles they once sold.
I do sympathize with the mechanics trying to stay up to date and fix the amazing machines we now take for granted.
Still, it could be a fun thing, but only if done in good humor, and not browbeating anyone for not knowing about stuff that's been obsolete for 30 years.
Mine isn't clean enough and not stock enough for me to even want to try.
cheers
Jay

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: 66vairman ()
Date: May 05, 2018 12:26PM

I have to agree with the folks that say a good technician STILL has to interpret things to fix a car - the computers DON'T tell you everything.

Also I've found dealership service to be much better now than it was in the 1970's (just awful then). My local dealership had a special on battery replacement. The service writer came out and put a load on the five year old battery and said "Actually it's in fair shape if you want to wait". I told him their sale was a good deal (cheaper than me buying a battery and putting it in) so just do it. Besides there was some corrosion on the terminals and I wasn't in the mood to mess with it.

When they were done I opened the hood prepared to complain about things and to my surprise cable terminals were all cleaned, and anti-corrosion sealer was on the terminals! I couldn't have done it better myself.

I've been taking my daily drive in for oil changes and it's always done in under 40 minutes AND I get a free sandwich at their waiting area. Everyone is polite and expedient.

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: oldqmguy ()
Date: May 05, 2018 12:37PM

I understand the "problem" of bringing an "old car" to a dealership for repair. spinning smiley sticking its tongue out

It has been pointed out that most of the Techs were not born when the last Corvair came off the assembly line. I see the same problem showing up in the electronic field. eye rolling smiley

The biggest problem is lack of proper training. You MUST learn the basics of the field you will be working in. This seems to be lost in most technical fields as they only teach what is currently in vogue! Why teach a person how a 'basic internal combustion engine' works when all you need to know is how the "current" engine works!? confused smiley

The Corvair has a really good following and is being restored and driven in many countries around the world so it isn't going away soon! grinning smiley

This brings me to a "sore point" with the Car Restoration programs now on TV. My two favorite shows are FantomWorks and Bitchin' Rides. These shops seem to repair, restore, customize and redesign all makes and models of cars EXCEPT CORVAIRS!! eye popping smiley

Given some of the rust buckets they have restored it makes no sense to "ignore" our favorite car. angry smiley

OK, off my soap box!

Dale cool smiley

Dale E. Smiley CPBE
Life Member The Society of Broadcast Engineers
RETIRED Broadcast Engineer
CERTIFIED CORVAIR NUT
CORSA/Circle City Corvairs/Corvair Performance Group
Avon, Indiana
WB9SFF
1967 4-Door Monza PG!

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: 140Vair ()
Date: May 05, 2018 11:46PM

Anyone have one of those original $150 certificates that '69 Corvair owners received? It would be funny to bring a ragged Corvair to a dealer for a trade-in with that certificate. grinning smiley

(Yes, yes. I know there was an expiration date, but it would be funny to see their reaction, nonetheless.)



"Charles" 68, Monza, 95, PG #7732, built 3rd wk of 01/68
Classic Corvairs of River City (Sacramento, CA)

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: Wagon Master ()
Date: May 06, 2018 05:31AM

oldqmguy Wrote:
> My two favorite
> shows are FantomWorks and Bitchin' Rides. These
> shops seem to repair, restore, customize and
> redesign all makes and models of cars EXCEPT
> CORVAIRS!! eye popping smiley

>
> OK, off my soap box!
>
> Dale cool smiley


You've never seen the EM vert. on display out in front of FantomWorks? They also did a parade EM for a gentleman.

'29 Ford Model A Tudor
'61 700 Lakewood 110 4 speed
'69 Monza Convert. 140 Auto.
'70 Dodge Challenger R/T 440 4 speed

Been aircooled since 1973
Northwest Ohio

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: oldqmguy ()
Date: May 06, 2018 06:21AM

I have seen the EM on display in front of FantomWorks but I have never seen them actually working on one!

I figure Dan would probably be the one that would do Corvairs. Dave Kindig(Bitchin' Rides) is probably to young to be interested in these!

I have only been watching these shows for two years so I have probably missed a few. Velocity has lots of shows but these are my favorites.

Dale cool smiley

Dale E. Smiley CPBE
Life Member The Society of Broadcast Engineers
RETIRED Broadcast Engineer
CERTIFIED CORVAIR NUT
CORSA/Circle City Corvairs/Corvair Performance Group
Avon, Indiana
WB9SFF
1967 4-Door Monza PG!

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: steve57 ()
Date: May 06, 2018 07:05AM

When I purchased my Corvair, the P.O. handed me a stack of invoices from our local Chevy dealer, Three Way Chevrolet. Dated from 1999 thru 2012.He And his wife had purchased the car in Maryland in 1999 and drove out to Bakersfield,Ca. When I asked him why did you take it to the dealer? He said, You can’t go wrong Goodwrench!

Steve
Bakersfield,Ca
69 monza 110,4 speed #4593

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: irfgt ()
Date: May 06, 2018 08:45AM

I would love to see the look on a typical Corvair owner's face when given a repair bill from Fantomworks! Many years ago I took my Corsa clock to the clock repairman at Charlotte Autofair to be changed over to quartz. I'll never forget what he said to me when I told him I wanted him to do parts and labor. He said I cAN'T BELIEVE THIS, cORVAIR PEOPLE ARE THE CHEAPEST car people in the world. I've never had a Corvair person want parts and labor done.

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: jmaechtlen ()
Date: May 06, 2018 12:32PM

heh - it would be wonderful to be able to just go quality and not worry about the cost!

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: Setterz54 ()
Date: May 06, 2018 03:30PM

I took one of my corvairs to a chevy dealer once so they could see it. They liked it and enjoyed looking at it. I had sales people parts guys and mechanics out there. It was kind of fun.

Setterz54
Fulton,MD.

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: May 07, 2018 03:40AM

My 2015 Sierra went into the shop for a P0172 code (fuel trim system too rich). Truck is still there and might be ready tomorrow afternoon. They replaced the #7 and #8 injectors because they were leaking. During post maintenance run, their computer showed them the fuel trim was still too rich. Truck is still running rough.

They are at a stand still until they and the warranty rep figure out next steps. I asked them to put 10 gallons of fuel in it and run it 40 miles since I had put BG44K in the 12/4 tank of fuel and that may be affecting the fuel trim. This is something I told them at induction. Well, they did, but that didn't help.

The next step is back to being a mechanic, but none are there. They are working with warranty to shotgun replace the #1, #3 and #5 injectors hoping it fixes the fuel trim issue. (I wonder if the #2, #4 & #6 might be the problem, hmmmm?)

Glad I bought the extended warranty. Going to cost me $100 for over $800 of parts and labor.

Al Lane
Ellabell GA

1966 Monza Coupe, 110 hp, 4 Spd
1968 Camaro SS Coupe 350 CI 295+ HP PG
1964 Greenbrier Deluxe, 6 dr, 80 hp car engine, PG
2015 Chevrolet Malibu 2LT
2018 Chevrolet Silverado LTZ Z71 Centennial Edition
1947 Farmall A tractor 15 hp


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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: playerpage ()
Date: May 07, 2018 01:42PM

Ah Warranties. My 2011 Silverado seized upon it's driver side door lock the other day. I bought it with an extended warranty from the dealer in 2014. The door simply would not unlock from the inside or the outside manually or with the button. I was climbing in and out from the passenger side and making quite a picture everywhere I went.

So I asked him to take a look at it. What the heck it's under warranty. Nope. The warranty had expired three weeks hence.

I also agree with those who say that it's important to know the basics and a Corvair is perfect for that. The local high school here uses them as their shop cars for teaching the kids.

Eric C. Player
Porterville, CA
- National Member, CORSA
- Member: Central Coast CORSA & South Coast CORSA
Former Member: Vintage CORSA Orange County. Member, ISA (Int. Screenwriter's Assn.), SAG Eligible, and Producer's Guild Aspirant


* Then: 1966 Corsa 180 Turbo, Red/1965 Monza 110 Purple/
1967 Monza 140 Red/1966 500 110 Black/1965 Monza 110 Yellow
* Now: 1966 Corsa 180 Turbo Project. Blue, Blue/Beige interior.



"Chevrolet's Corvair was a maverick machine, a rear-engined renegade born out of spite and genius." -- Sports Car Graphic, August 1969




Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/07/2018 01:45PM by playerpage.

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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: May 07, 2018 05:07PM

Glad I got the 100k warranty. 5 injectors, 2 pipes, 8 gaskets and $1682 in charges later, the truck is fixed. My $100 deductible was what I paid. Almost paid for the extended warranty fee and I have another 46k to go.

Oh, I had to pay $20 for gas I asked them to put in and $74 for a right rear tire sensor that wasn't covered.

After the warranty, I'll remember to replace all injectors when I get the 172 code and motor on. No need to go to the dealer to have injector replacements. They are simple enough, if you have the gaskets.

Al Lane
Ellabell GA

1966 Monza Coupe, 110 hp, 4 Spd
1968 Camaro SS Coupe 350 CI 295+ HP PG
1964 Greenbrier Deluxe, 6 dr, 80 hp car engine, PG
2015 Chevrolet Malibu 2LT
2018 Chevrolet Silverado LTZ Z71 Centennial Edition
1947 Farmall A tractor 15 hp


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Re: Bringing a Corvair to a modern day Chevy dealership
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: May 15, 2018 09:26AM

I explained about my GMC fuel injection issue in previous entry. Well they still haven't fixed it in 3 tries. Code P219a keeps coming up about 80 miles after they declare it fixed. This time (4th) I took it in a fuel line coupler tool was discovered on my cowl area. The VP and I had a long talk about my truck and the service I was receiving. He also understood I would no longer be their test driver. I then gave him the tool and said his service quality was lacking with repeat issues and tools being found by customers. He is making tech pay a ransom for the tool. There is also the threat of a new truck deal being derailed if things don't improve with my truck. The VP and Service Rep both know not to call me until the rep has driven the truck 200 miles with several power cycles on the computer to ensure it it fixed this time. Service Manager wanted his rental back last time after the changed the oil and declared it fixed. Won't fall for his crap any more. VP understands my frustration and what I want.

Al Lane
Ellabell GA

1966 Monza Coupe, 110 hp, 4 Spd
1968 Camaro SS Coupe 350 CI 295+ HP PG
1964 Greenbrier Deluxe, 6 dr, 80 hp car engine, PG
2015 Chevrolet Malibu 2LT
2018 Chevrolet Silverado LTZ Z71 Centennial Edition
1947 Farmall A tractor 15 hp


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