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Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: RedRail ()
Date: October 29, 2010 11:35AM

Hello... I am sitting in the shop studying my Corvair Sand Rail, as suggested by a previous thread.

I thought I might share a cool Disk Brake setup for the rear of a '64. We decided the iron drums were out if we could design a disk brake system. After a day at the junk yard, with a list of cars with the right 4 bolt pattern, we found the right offset and size in a '93 Suzuki Swift front. Now we needed a miracle bracket to hold it all in exactly the right place. Using some 1/4" plate with a little torch work and a lot more sparks, it all bolted up the Corvair axels. Cost was only a couple of hundred dollars, including trick rotors. I dont know if it fits a stock wheel, but it might. Oh, yeah, I had to get the axel machined a bit to clear the center of rotor.
http://www.dunebuggy.com/users/herkey43

Anyone else built a similar setup?

Gary...
'64 Corvair Sand Rod
'74 Vega Wagon- LT1, T400, 12 Bolt

On the Siuslaw River... Florence Oregon

Attachments:

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: gwydionjhr ()
Date: October 29, 2010 12:02PM

It looks really good, but does it pivot with the outboard axle bearing?

Regards,
Joel Rushworth
1961 Rampside w/Deluxe Scamper Camper
1966 Corsized Cdn Monza Coupe
1967 UV #292
"Kick the Hell out of the Status Quo" - Ed Cole

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: RedRail ()
Date: October 29, 2010 12:18PM

The axel and bearing is stock. The bracket and calipers bolt up to the end of the A arm where the drum backing plate would go. The Axel lug bolts go thru the rotor to the wheel. Brakes work really well, and reduce the unsprung weight a lot.

Gary...
'64 Corvair Sand Rod
'74 Vega Wagon- LT1, T400, 12 Bolt

On the Siuslaw River... Florence Oregon

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: 62corvairjunky ()
Date: October 29, 2010 12:29PM

Just a note to let you know,As Joel pointed out.
The axle and a-arm do not pivot on the same axis as the suspension articulates.
This will cause a certain amount of binding while you drive.
Maybe wont be a problem for you, but something to watch for anyway.

Junky
Hurricane Utah.
Home of the "Red Desert Corvair Sanctuary."

<a href="[photobucket.com]; target="_blank"><img src="[i866.photobucket.com]; border="0" alt=" photo 7121255b-53ac-4335-a3ba-83724bf6f396_zps111b404a.jpg"/></a>

62 Rusty Rampy
62 wagon under construction.(Taking all my time and $$)
61 lakewood parts car.
61 Lakewood wagon project.
half a dozen parts cars n trucks or more.
20x40 garage full of greasy parts.

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: RedRail ()
Date: October 29, 2010 12:43PM

Hmmm... So are you suggesting that the position of the rotor may vary as the suspension moves? Interesting... I will check for that the next time I have the springs off.

Gary...
'64 Corvair Sand Rod
'74 Vega Wagon- LT1, T400, 12 Bolt

On the Siuslaw River... Florence Oregon

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: Mel ()
Date: October 29, 2010 04:01PM

Looks goodthumbs up but I think if you hit a bunch of severe bumps in the road it will pump the fluid out of the caliper and back to the mastersad smiley.

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: Mlevair ()
Date: October 29, 2010 04:59PM

The kit I make provides for this.

LeVair Performance & Restoration
Michael LeVeque
Fayetteville Tennesse
765-617-9307
Mlevair@sbcglobal.net

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: wv-geo ()
Date: October 29, 2010 06:32PM

Mlevair Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The kit I make provides for this.


When will it be available?

Dan Stark
Hurricane, WV

1961 Lakewood 500, 80HP, PG
1964 Corvair 500 Coupe, 140HP, 4spd (Christine)
1965 Mustang Coupe, 6cyl, 3spd

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Date: October 29, 2010 08:41PM

This has been the classic problem with rear early disc kits. Michael says he has the problem beat but I don't know of anyone who has seen this yet.

It's amazing to me how many people have said they've designed a rear disc setup for the swing axle and when asked about caliper/rotor alignment problems they say "huh"?

There are of course ways to do it but they involve substantial and complex (that means $$$$) redesigning of the rear axle setup. Have you really fixed the problem Michael and how much does it cost?

Lon
www.corvairunderground.com
This weekend sees the end of October specials and sales!

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: UGLYTRUK ()
Date: October 29, 2010 08:47PM

Is the pivot issue because the axle moves in a diff arc than the A Arm? Thus the pivoting bearing

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: Scott V ()
Date: October 30, 2010 03:47AM

RedRail Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Brakes work really
> well, and reduce the unsprung weight a lot.

very cool. do you have a weight for the disk kit? usually stock type drum brakes weight less than stock type disk & caliper setups.

-Scott V.

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: solo2r ()
Date: October 30, 2010 10:25AM

If the original backing plate is bolted to the torque arm, why dont the drum brakes bind then?

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: Mel ()
Date: October 30, 2010 10:39AM

Actually I think they can/or could bind a little, thats why the rear brake drum is quite a bit wider than the brake shoes, I think the adjustment specs for rear shoes are different then the front shoes,(looser than fronts/more clearance between shoe face and drum friction surface)

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: Andrew ()
Date: October 30, 2010 01:28PM

corvairunderground Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This has been the classic problem with rear early
> disc kits. Michael says he has the problem beat
> but I don't know of anyone who has seen this yet.
>
> It's amazing to me how many people have said
> they've designed a rear disc setup for the swing
> axle and when asked about caliper/rotor alignment
> problems they say "huh"?
>
> There are of course ways to do it but they
> involve substantial and complex (that means $$$$)
> redesigning of the rear axle setup. Have you
> really fixed the problem Michael and how much does
> it cost?
>
> Lon
> www.corvairunderground.com
> This weekend sees the end of October specials and
> sales!


I've seen Micheals' EM rear disc setup up close and personal. It certainly appears that he has taken into account for the axles swiveling. Looked like a clever solution. Last time I saw him he said that he didn't feel he had enough miles on it yet to call it done. Building something that works properly is one thing...building it to also last is another. Can't fault a guy for wanting to test it for durability and reliability. Something like that you can hardly test enough.

I have some pictures of the setup but won't post them here. Seems like when someone builds a better mousetrap, next thing you know someone else is copying the design and calling it their own.


Need another Beta-tester Micheal?

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: SpyderMan ()
Date: October 30, 2010 08:46PM

I saw them on Rick's car at the convention this year and they looked great. I hope there will be a kit available for us one of these days.

Sam Russell
Durham NC
1962 Monza Wagon
1964 Spyder coupe


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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: Mlevair ()
Date: October 31, 2010 07:40AM

If you look carefully at early cars brake shoes they wear kind of round instead of flat because of the drum movement in relationship to the shoes.

LeVair Performance & Restoration
Michael LeVeque
Fayetteville Tennesse
765-617-9307
Mlevair@sbcglobal.net

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: Mlevair ()
Date: October 31, 2010 07:46AM

I just tried to post some pics but all my pics are too big.

LeVair Performance & Restoration
Michael LeVeque
Fayetteville Tennesse
765-617-9307
Mlevair@sbcglobal.net

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: martyscarr ()
Date: October 31, 2010 07:56AM

I just tried to post some pics but all my pics are too big.


Send them to me and I'll resize them for you

Marty Scarr

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Date: October 31, 2010 05:59PM

I don't want Michael to misunderstand my comments. He's a sharp guy and if he says it works - then it works. The point is, of course, he isn't exactly saying it "works" yet - and that's the most honest point of view with a new product like this that seems to have baffled everyone else so far.

We came up with various scenarios when we were designing our other Corvair disc brake conversions that we think would have worked well with early rears - BUT the kits would have been expensive - $1500.00 or worse. But then we had to be concerned about long life and reliability.

In this respect these early rear conversions have somewhat been just like the electric fans and (most) of the fuel injection conversions. They look great and wow, and they even "work" most of the time.......but they invariably find their way on "gee whiz" show cars and are lucky if they see 500 actual miles.

In Corvairs that are driven to any degree in the real world the bar is set considerable higher. Let's suppose someone has managed to fit discs on the back of a 64 - they look cool, and they will actually stop the car pretty well.

But how do we know what they will do 1000 or 10,000 miles from now? Will they catastrophically fail on interstate 5 in downtown LA going 75 mph in the left lane, taking out 50 other cars and drivers because the alignment issue fatigued a structural part of the conversion?

I'm not being paranoid, I'm just reminding everyone that there is a serious alignment issue from an engineering point of view here. That is a basic fact that requires an extraordinary solution. If Michael (or anyone else) has found an economical solution to this then more power to them.

Lon wall
www.corvairunderground.com
800-825-8247
October sales end midnight tonight!

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Re: Disk Brakes '64
Posted by: Scott V ()
Date: November 01, 2010 02:26AM

corvairunderground Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> In this respect these early rear conversions
> have somewhat been just like the electric fans and
> (most) of the fuel injection conversions. They
> look great and wow, and they even "work" most of
> the time.......but they invariably find their way
> on "gee whiz" show cars and are lucky if they see
> 500 actual miles.

i think you got the fuel injection reference backwards. from what i have seen/heard there are many more efi engines running on non-show cars than 'gee whiz' / less than 500 actual mile cars w/efi.

-Scott V.

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