CORSA Board of Directors Election & Ballot Harvesting.

Please be advised that the national office will not count ballots that have been harvested in bulk.


According to Article VII Section 3 of the CORSA Bylaws, “It is the duty of the Election Chair to ensure the fair and diligent conduct of the following procedure. The CORSA Secretary shall serve as the Election Chair each year; provided however, if the CORSA Secretary is eligible for candidacy in a given year, then the CORSA President shall appoint another Board member who is not eligible for candidacy that year.”


It has come to my attention that an envelope containing a significant number of ballots for the 2023 CORSA Directors election was received by the national CORSA office from one of our chapters. That the ballots were mailed in batch by a third party rather than by the individual CORSA members meets the definition of vote harvesting.


Therefore, in my capacity as Election Chair, I have instructed the CORSA Executive Secretary not to count them but instead, return those ballots to the secretary of the chapter involved. The affected members are welcome to recast their votes individually using either the online ballot or by mailing their marked ballots individually to the national CORSA office.


Vote harvesting is the collection of absentee ballots - also known as mail-in ballots - from voters by a third party who then delivers them to election officials. Allowing individuals other than the voter or his immediate family to handle absentee ballots is a recipe for mischief and wrongdoing in the election context. Neither voters nor election officials have the means of verifying that the secrecy of the ballot has not been compromised or that the ballot submitted in the voter’s name by a third party actually contains votes for the voter’s intended candidates and was not fraudulently changed by the vote harvester.


Although CORSA elections are not beholden to federal or state regulations, vote harvesting is prohibited by 23 of the 50 States of the Union. According to the Heritage Foundation, “The handling of absentee ballots should be restricted to voters, most immediate family members, or an individual residing in their household. This will prevent campaigns, political parties, and other third parties from handling absentee ballots.”


In my judgement, the prohibition of vote harvesting in CORSA elections is within my authority to ensure the fair and diligent conduct of our elections. This prohibition shall be applied across the board to any and all chapters that engage in ballot harvesting. Also, please be careful to respect the privacy of individuals while they cast their votes. No poll-watching please.


Allan Lacki
Secretary to the Board and Election Chair
Corvair Society of America

I recommend making this a "Sticky"

I am trying to keep my mouth shut, but cant! So you are saying if a club mails all their votes in one envelope you are going to reject those votes? This was permitted in the past and now suddenly its against the rules? I mean how hard is it to verify the votes? There are what maybe a 1000 members of the central Corsa division? And most times not all of them vote? Why not contact the Club / Members and verify their Votes if you question them? Also I find it very disturbing that you are basically calling Corsa members cheaters!







1960 4dr sedan caveman car
1961 Rampside (Chetside)
1962 Rampside (Barnside)
1962 Short Rampside (Shortside)
1962 Monza 700 Wagon
1963 Monza 900 coup (General Nader)

-----------------------------------
Rust Free Lancaster Ca

I remember voting several times over the years at club meetings and it being handled this way. A lot of people show up at local meetings driving a Buick and do not use computers. Is there any proof these ballots could be corrupt or not genuine? Seems odd to change the rules in the middle of an election especially without proof. This is a stretch at best and at this time during open voting appears almost like the BOD is doing a little electioneering (unless of course this is your decision only) I would bet the 'significant number' is probably less than a dozen.I would think a quick phone call to these members would have resolved the matter in a much better manor.

Ballot harvesting is more than just being worried about the votes being real. It is about people that wouldn't have voted without the harvesting. The thought is they are voting with whoever is doing the harvesting and wouldn't have voted otherwise.
I am NOT saying that is what is going on here. A CORSA election is MUCH different than a government election. I wouldn't think anyone would be cheating here.
In conclusion in government elections I am very strongly against ballot harvesting but for CORSA I see no issue with everyone at a club meeting sending in their votes together unless there is a lot of contention and ill will that I am completely unaware of.

Joel
Northlake, TX
5 Ultravans, 145 Corvairs and counting...

I get a ballot with my Communique and I wouldn't think of going through my local chapter to vote. I would put it in an envelope and put a stamp on it myself. Either that or logging in is the way it says to do it on the ballot.
Perhaps my vision is skewed because Corvair Minnesota has never seemed to beat the CORSA drum a lot. I personally enjoy being a CORSA member.
If people don't follow the instructions on the ballot how else are the CORSA officials supposed to correct it except by taking a stand? You still have 3 weeks to send it in correctly. I don't know which volunteer is supposed to have the time to call everyone to check ballots. Just the fact that no one answers their phone anymore would make this a frustrating task.
As a general rule I am not in favor of easy peasy no verification shortcut voting anywhere.

Jim Brandberg
Isanti, MN
CorvairRepair.com

My own thought is, any club or even a classroom does their voting by writing something on a piece of paper, folding it and then putting it in the bin. Even at car shows, they just pull them out and read them off. Unless they provide an envelope to every single person at a club meeting, who then puts their vote in the envelope before putting it in the box, there's just no other way to gather signatures in an open meeting. This does strike me as overboard, and if the voting is already started and there's bylaws that cover it, why change now?

I'm sorry, Allan, but are you doing this on your own authority? You quoted a piece of the bylaws that says you are responsible for the implementation of the "following procedure," but you do not then recite the procedure. If the bylaws don't discourage single envelope voting, how can you?

Eric C. Player
Fargo, North Dakota
MEMBER: CORSA National, Central Coast CORSA, South Coast CORSA, Vintage CORSA, Sfba CORSA, and Great Plains Corvair Club.
THEN: 1965 Monza 110, Canary Yellow - 1965 Corsa 180 Turbo, Red - 1966 Monza 110, Purple - 1967 Monza 140, Red - 1966 500 110, Black; nicknamed "Shadow" - 1965 Monza 110, Camaro Yellow; nicknamed "Silver"
NOW: 1966 Corsa 180 Turbo, Blue; nicknamed "Bluvair"
---------------------------------------
"He cautioned me not to take notes. It would not have helped if I had, as he would start a paragraph with, 'It is therefore obvious. . .'
and go on from there to matters which may have been obvious to him and God but to no one else."
-- Robert A. Heinlein, character of Daniel B. Davis, 'The Door Into Summer.'

This. This is what drives people away from the club. Politics, personal agendas. Multiple facebook posts, forum posts about this person allegedly did this, or that...

In this age of "Everyone is connected to everyone" - do Regional Directors even matter?


Eric P.
DeWitt, IA

Everybody, Please read this.

If you ever found out the national office allowed ballot stuffing to go unchecked, then you'd all be ready to hang us from the rafters for being cavalier about the potential for election fraud. And I would expect you to.

Unlike most past years, this year's election is attracting much attention.

By the way, as of today (May 10th), the national office received only one envelope with multiple ballots stuffed inside.

Allan, than you for your May 10th 2:44 PM post. The poop is flying and there are respectable people saying the CORSA Club office received envelopes and boxes of ballots. You have contacted Vulcan Corvair Club and put us on notice that our one envelope was rejected and sent back to the Vulcan Club Secretary. Our club is preparing to fix the problem and resubmit as you requested. Jack Green your candidate for CORSA Director - Central Division.

Kind of an over reaction then if just (one) envelope came with a handful of ballots. Wow that would have been real work to check that out. The sky is falling!

Hi Jack, Thank you so much. That was really good of you to write that. This afternoon, one of the folks on the Board asked Paul Bergstrom at the CORSA office and asked if he had ever received bulk shipments of ballots. He said he has not in the several years when he's been involved. Yet several commenters have said their clubs have done it that way. So, maybe in the past it was common practice. Al

I wasn't going to say anything but I just can't stay silent anymore after learning that the only rejection of group votes was from the club where a member is also running as a candidate.

That's just awful! Come on!

- Art in Missouri
'66 Monza Convertible 110, 4SP, A/C


Previous Vairs:
63 Monza Coupe
66 Sport Sedan
66 Corsa (clone)
61 Loadside

Allan, since you brought up the Bylaws:

Per Corsa Bylaws, Section 3, Election of Directors, paragraph 5:

“Opening of Elections: The Election Chair shall establish the start and end date for the period when the Society will accept voter ballots. The duration of the election period shall be no less than two months. The start and end dates shall be announced in the Society’s publication no later than the start date that has been established. The same issue of the Society’s publication shall also contain the candidate’s biographies, photos and an election ballot. The election ballot shall instruct voting members to mail their completed ballots to the CORSA business office.”

Fact - ballots of this cycle did not become available until May 1, with publication of the May issue of the Comminique, with also included the statement that “Voting will end on May 31, 2023.”

This is a violation of the Bylaws which state “the duration of the election period shall be no less than two months.”

Bill Hubbell,
President, Stock Corvair Group

Interesting, Bill!

Frank DuVal

Fredericksburg, VA

Quote
Allan Lacki
By the way, as of today (May 10th), the national office received only one envelope with multiple ballots stuffed inside.

This smacks of "making a mountain out of a mole hill", making things sound worse than they really happen to be...

It will be vairy interesting to see what happens during and, most importantly, AFTER this election.

Dean F. Gemberling
Columbus, Georgia
Heart of Georgia Corvair Club Webmaster
Springfest Webmaster

1963 Rampside w/305 V8 - Built by Ken Arnold in 1998
1965 Monza Coupe - Converting from Drag Race Car to Nice Street Car - 63 Buick 215 V8

Suddenly it's 2020 again.

If only my hide sight was as good.


"Run She May, Shine She Must"
Been Aircooled Since 1973
Northwest Ohio 45840

Frankly, I think if it was only one envelope from one club, the CORSA Board (if it was a decision taken to the board) made a mistake in putting up this original post. No need to even stir this pot, just quietly let the chapter know to re-submit the ballots, please.

Now that it IS out there, this type of thing should be clarified for future elections.

And definitely the bylaws should be honored, so the election should last until June 30.

I'll stop talking, now. (Hear that, future me? No more posting about this!)

Eric C. Player
Fargo, North Dakota
MEMBER: CORSA National, Central Coast CORSA, South Coast CORSA, Vintage CORSA, Sfba CORSA, and Great Plains Corvair Club.
THEN: 1965 Monza 110, Canary Yellow - 1965 Corsa 180 Turbo, Red - 1966 Monza 110, Purple - 1967 Monza 140, Red - 1966 500 110, Black; nicknamed "Shadow" - 1965 Monza 110, Camaro Yellow; nicknamed "Silver"
NOW: 1966 Corsa 180 Turbo, Blue; nicknamed "Bluvair"
---------------------------------------
"He cautioned me not to take notes. It would not have helped if I had, as he would start a paragraph with, 'It is therefore obvious. . .'
and go on from there to matters which may have been obvious to him and God but to no one else."
-- Robert A. Heinlein, character of Daniel B. Davis, 'The Door Into Summer.'

It doesn't seem like waiting until the end of June for the full 60 days thing is a good option since the Directors meet at the Convention.
There's 2 or 3 weeks now which seems to be plenty of time to resend votes properly unless the proper ballot that came with the Communique has been used already. Maybe there's still the online option.
I don't know anything about what the issues may be but a group mailing from the home chapter where someone is running doesn't sound like a good thing to do.
I'm so glad I'm not on Facebook and such so this thread is all I know about the subject. Ignorance is bliss. I don't know why I'm even writing about it since I don't really care. The plus side is that I'll just keep paying CORSA dues along with Parts and Services listing annual fee wherever the chips may fall.

In hindsight whoever had the idea of getting a bunch of votes at a Chapter meeting and sending them in together didn't think it through very well.
I would tend to take Paul Bergstrom's word for it on whether group mailings are common. He's a Pontiac guy with no Corvair axe to grind that I can see.

We had a big stink in Corvair Minnesota a few years ago regarding By-Laws and the election was contentious. One side packed the room with good old boys, some of whom were not current with Dues and therefore not legitimate votes. As Membership Coordinator I didn't call them out for embarrassment but was prepared to contest the election if their votes would have made a difference.
I'm more ashamed that I kept quiet on a very important topic at the last meeting. The guy giving the Tech Session said the Specification for torquing heads to 35 or 38 was okay and I just sat on my hands. I can only hope that no crankcase threads will suffer from my silence.

Jim Brandberg
Isanti, MN
CorvairRepair.com

Hi Eric,

Thank you for your comment. You suggested that we should have done this more quietly, and I would have preferred to do it that way. But I wanted to make sure no other chapter did this, and so I wanted to get the word out there far and wide as soon as possible during this election cycle. You probably noticed that I never identified the chapter in question.

Al Lacki