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Salih jugs/cylinders
Posted by: scottymac ()
Date: September 13, 2022 01:34PM

Do the Salih jugs, with their aluminum fins, cool the engine any better than the stock cast iron jugs?

Scott
Danville, In.
'65 Corsa coupe basket case
'66 Monza coupe


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Re: Salih jugs/cylinders
Posted by: 63turbo ()
Date: September 13, 2022 05:18PM

I would bet that they do, and it is enough to compensate for the thinner walls those use. However, even if they do, the main value for cylinders that cool better is that potentially more can go to the heads and less to the cylinders. Approximately 1/3 of all the cooling air generated by the fan goes to the cylinders... the whole side of the cylinder closest to the fan tends to run at or below oil temperature, but the "baffle side" goes from 380 at the very top of the bore down to 253 at the base where it touches the crankcase. At one of the lower stud locations at the top of the bore its 341. It sure seems like theres some improvements to be had in both the shape of the cylinder baffles and the fin shape... too much fin on the fan side and not enough opening of the baffles near the top of the bore and too much opening near the bottom. Block off the "triangle" part of the baffle perhaps? make it a touch wider at the very top??
I've seen Porsche cylinders that dont have any fins on the fan side of the cylinder. Perhaps they are on to something!!!

------------------------------------

Kevin Nash
Friday Harbor Washington
63 Spyder, Daily driver, EFI read about my project here: [corvaircenter.com]
first test start on EFI here:[www.youtube.com]
first official EFI boost test here:[www.youtube.com]
My new fan! [corvaircenter.com]
engine less 62 Spyder
Canadian 64 Monza Parts car
Test Start#2 [www.youtube.com]



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Re: Salih jugs/cylinders
Posted by: scottymac ()
Date: September 16, 2022 08:57PM

So if I'm following your reasoning, Kevin, you're saying Salih got their engineering correct, as they appear similar to the Porsche you describe? The extra fins and extra square inches on the Howard jugs aren't that effective at reducing heat? If it were you that needed to repair a set of these jugs, you would choose the Salihs?

I found the recent discussion about turkey roasters interesting, especially about the lack of openings in the front of the '60 version, and the profile that section has. It also has the necessary attaching points for the K46 desert air scoop, so I snapped up an early shroud. Also got lucky finding a set of covers for the heater hoses. With your fan's help, Kevin, and a lot of sealing, engine should never overheat.

Scott
Danville, In.
'65 Corsa coupe basket case
'66 Monza coupe


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Re: Salih jugs/cylinders
Posted by: zarfnober ()
Date: September 17, 2022 07:04AM

scottymac Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So if I'm following your reasoning, Kevin, you're saying Salih got their engineering correct, as they appear similar to the Porsche you describe? The extra fins and extra square inches on the Howard jugs aren't that effective at reducing heat? If it were you that needed to repair a set of these jugs, you would choose the Salihs?
>

Do you also have a set of the Howard cylinders? Let me know if you decide to sell either, thanks!

Rocco

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Re: Salih jugs/cylinders
Posted by: joelsplace ()
Date: September 17, 2022 12:14PM

Kevin has another project!
Figure out the best cylinder shroud design and then figure out a pattern to mill fins off of the cylinders to get a consistent temperature around the cylinder.
Those high temperature variations would make the cylinder out of round at operating temps.
Then for the next project all aluminum Nikasil cylinders. Better cooling, big weight savings and longer lasting.

Joel
Northlake, TX
5 Ultravans, 138 Corvairs and counting...




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2022 12:18PM by joelsplace.

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Re: Salih jugs/cylinders
Posted by: 63turbo ()
Date: September 17, 2022 12:19PM

scottymac Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So if I'm following your reasoning, Kevin, you're saying Salih got their engineering correct, as they appear similar to the Porsche you describe? The extra fins and extra square inches on the Howard jugs aren't that effective at reducing heat? If it were you that needed to repair a set of these jugs, you would choose the Salihs?
>
> I found the recent discussion about turkey roasters interesting, especially about the lack of openings in the front of the '60 version, and the profile that section has. It also has the necessary attaching points for the K46 desert air scoop, so I snapped up an early shroud. Also got lucky finding a set of covers for the heater hoses. With your fan's help, Kevin, and a lot of sealing, engine should never overheat.


My comments about the Salih cylinders "probably" cooling better than the stock cylinders had to do with the fact they have aluminum fins on them... much greater ability to dump heat than the all iron stock ones. Until you posted the pictures of the Howards and Salih jugs though, I had never noticed that the fin spacing and thickness was different than stock and that the Howards cylinders were different than both the stock cylinders and the Salih cylinders. I dont know if that part matters... I was thinking perhaps that there might be a bit less flow area on the aluminum finned cylinders vs stock (which is a good thing) but hard to tell without measuring. I dont know if the Howards cylinders are necessarily a worse design, but would seem to require some modifications to the baffles to fit. Those baffles are super important- mess those things up and both the cylinders and the heads wont cool well! I "believe" that both the cylinders and heads will cool better if the baffles were modified to allow less flow near the bottom of the cylinder. This causes the air to have to move faster though the upper portion of the cylinder and causes more air to go over the heads!
I think if I had to repair a set of cylinders, I would probably go with the Salih cylinders if at the bore sizes those go to, and the Howards if at the bore sizes those go to.

------------------------------------

Kevin Nash
Friday Harbor Washington
63 Spyder, Daily driver, EFI read about my project here: [corvaircenter.com]
first test start on EFI here:[www.youtube.com]
first official EFI boost test here:[www.youtube.com]
My new fan! [corvaircenter.com]
engine less 62 Spyder
Canadian 64 Monza Parts car
Test Start#2 [www.youtube.com]






Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/17/2022 12:25PM by 63turbo.

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