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Corvair Mysteries
Date: October 10, 2020 01:56PM

Filed under "That's just the way it was".....

1.) GM changed to "Alternating Current Generators" across the entire GM lineup in 1963.
Why did the Corvair continue with that heavy "old fashion" DC generator for 1963 & 1964?
The alternator became standard in 1965 with a couple easy changes - so we know they could do it. Why wait two years?

2.) Why did our man Don Yenko make the "Yenko Stinger" using a COPO order of 1966 Corsa models - instead of a COPO order of 1966 Corvair 500 models?
the 140HP 4 speed was a RPO (Regular Production Option) and the other COPO stuff could have included a Corsa dash, I'd bet - but, even if it did'nt, who cares! Racers are going to add real gauges anyway and Don could have put a tachometer in the blank center hole of the 500 models.
Racers would ditch the heavy Corsa/Monza "bucket seats" anyway - in favor of much better/lighter seats for racing. Don could have - should have done that to make the Stiner a "sports car" anyway. The rear seat on the 500 was a much lighter and easier to toss into the dumpster, right?
The 500 was an easier start to a real race car, IMHO....

3.) GMC came up with l'Universalle - a light delivery van concept in 1955 and the design morphed into the Corvan in 1961. So, since GMC made their own version of standard Chevrolet pick-ups and Suburbans - why did'nt GMC make their own version of the Corvan and Rampside?
Dave Newell wrote an article about GMC design studies for the Communique - which shows that they were thinking about it..... Why did'nt they pull the trigger?!?

I know there are more....


Dan Davis ~ Pierce County, WA ~ CORSA Western Director + Corvairs NW + North Cascades Corvairs + Corvanatics
1966 Corsa Turbo coupe ~ ~ 1966 Corsa 140 Coupe ~ ~ 1965 Monza 140/4 Convertible Sierra Tan/Fawn ~ 1964 Monza Spyder Convertible ~ 1960 Monza Ermine White/Red PG ++ ~ 1965 Monza 140/4 CoupeEvening Orchid w/ ivory/black interior ~ 1962 Monza Wagon 102/4 ~ 1963 Rampside/Scamper ~ 1963 Red/Greenbrier ~ 1969 Ultra Van #468

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: Seth Emerson ()
Date: October 10, 2020 02:04PM

1966 was light years away from now. Most Yenko Stingers were not race cars and needed streetable buckets seats. Most Stingers, back then, even when raced, used stock dashboards - maybe with a tach added in an easier to read place. Yeah, today the racers might throw away everything and start with a shell, but not then. A handful may have done that.


Alternator? Beats me, maybe it took them a year to test the reverse flow cooling fan!<grin>

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: acardon ()
Date: October 10, 2020 02:25PM

Casting and testing the mounting bracket may have had something to do with the delay. SBC's used a simple bracket.

Don
Southlake, Texas
The Trunk Belongs in Front, Ask Any Elephant
Caution: Images in This Mirror May be Waterpumpers

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: irfgt ()
Date: October 10, 2020 04:06PM

Could have been a Union contract to fill to keep producing Generators plus it would help cover warranty and aftermarket sales. Since The Corvair engine was a Chevrolet and GMC is such a minority with a much smaller Dealer network, it only made sense to go with the Chevy for the Van.

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: Seth Emerson ()
Date: October 10, 2020 04:11PM

OOOH! I wonder what Steve was going to say! <grin>

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: 66vairman ()
Date: October 10, 2020 04:35PM

Interesting topics.

Here is another - Why were the model year 65 Corvairs only equipped with front seat belts as standard?

Speculative answer: Due to the upcoming, but NOT implemented, safety laws Ford and GM decided to get a jump on seat belt installation. That and a few states required front only seat belts back then. In spite of the Federal rules not taking effect until 1968 (for 1967 model year cars) GM started installing front AND rear seat belts in the 1966 model year cars. Why the one year wait for making rear seat belts standard?

I got a great answer from someone who worked for an auto parts manufacturer --- The sudden demand by Ford and GM for seat belts front and rear simply could not be meant by the manufactures. So only front seat belts were standard until manufacturing could ramp up to make enough seat belts to allow front AND rear seat belts to be standard equipment.

Same with the alternator - with a huge demand for the alternator on Chevy engines in 63 I doubt there was any incentive to engineer a "unique" Corvair front housing and fan to get the alternator into the Corvair. The Corvair 1965 model goal was to be "new" and improved and continuing with the generator would have been a negative. Just my opinon!

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: Phil Dally ()
Date: October 10, 2020 04:38PM

Why is it that you can never have just one?

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: joelsplace ()
Date: October 10, 2020 06:32PM

2) I thought the Stingers didn't come with a rear seat.

Joel
Northlake, TX
5 Ultravans, 113 Corvairs and counting...

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: steve c goodman ()
Date: October 10, 2020 06:36PM

Seth Emerson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> OOOH! I wonder what Steve was going to say! <grin>

Steve sez: I commented on the Yenko paragraph and then decided that actual owners and those are the dealership were more knowledgeable. I said nothing negative. I just decided it needed those who experienced the stingers be the ones who should speak up.

best wishes, Steve
Rear Engine Spec. Inc. Golden, Colo.

1962 spyder 3.0L turbo---1965 Crown V8
1967 monza 110/4---1968 monza 110/4
1971 amante gt 110/4
CORSA/RMC/PPCC/V8 Registry

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: jjohnsonjo ()
Date: October 10, 2020 07:02PM

Geez Steve, I thought you meant the OP should be deleted LOLspinning smiley sticking its tongue out

J.O.

65 Corsa Turbo Vert
79 Honda XL 500S
69 Honda CL 160 D
2010 BMW F 650 GS
2003 Bounder 36D
2013 KIA Optima SX turbo-AKA ZIPPY (wife,s car)
69 Newport Holiday Sailboat
Baja 150 dune buggy cart
Coleman HS 500 UTV
2016 KIA Sorento SXL Turbo

Bethlehem,Pa


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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: RexJohnson ()
Date: October 10, 2020 07:43PM

On the rear seat belts the middle one was an option for a couple of years.

RJ tools
Salem,Oregon

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: zarfnober ()
Date: October 11, 2020 05:35AM

As for the Stingers, 67’s were built out of Monzas, tach went where a clock would go, the oil pressure, amp meter and oil temp(I think!) gauges were put in a 3 hole mount under the ash tray. So, the question SHOULD have been “why didn’t they COPO a Corsa dash in there?!!!!!!”.

Not that I really care, as it makes my 67 that much more unique.

Rocco

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: Layton Curtis ()
Date: October 11, 2020 04:42PM

Why did the jarheads at GM not sue Viton? Dupont marketed it starting in 1958 and it was the pump makers answer to longevity for their products.

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: American Mel ()
Date: October 11, 2020 04:50PM

Jarheads at GM ? ? ?
Marines ran G.M.? confused smiley

-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
WA. state, 1 mile south of the Canadian border,
I am not at the end of the world, but you can see it from here.
Have; '66 Monza Coupe - 140, 4-spd. Daily driver beater
'67 Monza Vert. - 140, 4-spd. Daily driver beater
'67 A/C Moredoor Monza
Have had; '61 Monza coupe, 80hp, PG
'62 Monza Wagon, 4spd.
'63 Spyder,
'65 Corsa
.
non-vair
'04 Dodge Cummins Quad Dually, approaching 400K
'03 Honda Del Sol
17'Terry

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: caroseiii ()
Date: October 11, 2020 05:31PM

That is so simple, the Corvair was an economy car and the generator was $20 less expensive than an alternator. The Delcotron was an expensive assembly. The Parts and Accessories catalog for 1965 tells the tale. See attached showing differences.

Crawford

C.A. Rose
Metairie, LA
1962 Spyders

Attachments:
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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: American Mel ()
Date: October 11, 2020 05:48PM

caroseiii Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That is so simple, the Corvair was an economy car and the generator was $20 less expensive than an alternator. The Delcotron was an expensive assembly. The Parts and Accessories catalog for 1965 tells the tale. See attached showing differences.
>
> Crawford


Indeed.
Also keep in mind, $20.oo in 1964 was equivalent to $166.oo today.
Now spread that over the total production run of Corvairs in '64.

-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-
WA. state, 1 mile south of the Canadian border,
I am not at the end of the world, but you can see it from here.
Have; '66 Monza Coupe - 140, 4-spd. Daily driver beater
'67 Monza Vert. - 140, 4-spd. Daily driver beater
'67 A/C Moredoor Monza
Have had; '61 Monza coupe, 80hp, PG
'62 Monza Wagon, 4spd.
'63 Spyder,
'65 Corsa
.
non-vair
'04 Dodge Cummins Quad Dually, approaching 400K
'03 Honda Del Sol
17'Terry

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Date: October 11, 2020 06:19PM

caroseiii Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That is so simple, the Corvair was an economy car and the generator was $20 less expensive than an alternator. The Delcotron was an expensive assembly. The Parts and Accessories catalog for 1965 tells the tale. See attached showing differences.
> Crawford

If the "economy car" hypothesis was correct, then the Chevy II would have also had a generator.
Chevy II had the generator in 1962. This was upgraded to the alternator in 1963.

Corvair alone had a generator in 1963 & 1964


Dan Davis ~ Pierce County, WA ~ CORSA Western Director + Corvairs NW + North Cascades Corvairs + Corvanatics
1966 Corsa Turbo coupe ~ ~ 1966 Corsa 140 Coupe ~ ~ 1965 Monza 140/4 Convertible Sierra Tan/Fawn ~ 1964 Monza Spyder Convertible ~ 1960 Monza Ermine White/Red PG ++ ~ 1965 Monza 140/4 CoupeEvening Orchid w/ ivory/black interior ~ 1962 Monza Wagon 102/4 ~ 1963 Rampside/Scamper ~ 1963 Red/Greenbrier ~ 1969 Ultra Van #468

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: joelsplace ()
Date: October 11, 2020 08:42PM

I don't think the GM price list necessarily has anything to do with the cost to produce an item.
We'll never know but it could have been as simple as they had a ton of them to use up so even if it cost more in total to produce, if they had a bunch of them already made then it would be "cheaper" than not using them.
Unless the diodes were crazy expensive I can't see how the alternator was more expensive to produce than a generator with a lot more copper and steel in it except that all the tooling and what not for making generators was already there.

Joel
Northlake, TX
5 Ultravans, 113 Corvairs and counting...

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: 66vairman ()
Date: October 11, 2020 09:18PM

joelsplace Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Unless the diodes were crazy expensive I can't see how the alternator was more expensive to produce than a generator with a lot more copper and steel in it except that all the tooling and what not for making generators was already there.


The answers are long gone, but you make a valid argument. Alternating power generators were used with expensive rectifiers by the military in some vehicles. in the 50's.

It was Chrysler corp. that designed the first cost effective alternator using compact solid state diodes to rectify the alternating current for DC automotive systems.

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Re: Corvair Mysteries
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: October 12, 2020 02:04AM

It was all a cost thing. My theory is:

The Vair generator was unique to the Vair along with a engine mount adapter incorporating the oil filter, filler and the other items on it. Their planning had to take into account the unique engine part & generator being used up close to introduction of the new alternator and new Delcotron engine adapter. Why do you think the 1965 trucks still used the generator. Low volume where they could control the final use of the parts being phased out. What few parts remained unused could be sold to dealers as spares for over counter sales.

Al
Georgia

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