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Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: May 12, 2019 11:47AM

I just took out the steering box out of the 66 More Door and found it is different than the one I have almost ready to put back in. This one has a short shaft (1 3/8") and the box is aluminum. Part number on the box is 5673581. (not listed in parts book or comes up in Clark's search)

What gearbox do I need to get to get this steering fixed? The box I took out is now locked up and can't be rotated using force from my body.

It is very apparent the 66 gearboxes have a steering shaft to long to go in place of it. Unless I could unbolt the shaft from the large coupler up top and then my 66 gearbox might fit. The shaft currently there is 14 1/4 from the bottom of the top coupler to the bottom of the bottom coupler. Is that about the right length of the 66 gearbox steering shaft?

Al Lane
Ellabell, GA 31308

1966 Monza Coupe, 110 hp, 4 Spd
1966 Monza More Door 110 hp, PG
1968 Camaro SS Coupe 350 CI 295+ hp PG
1964 Greenbrier Deluxe, 6 dr, 80 hp car engine, PG
1947 Farmall A tractor 15 hp





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/12/2019 11:50AM by Lane66m.

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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Vairismo ()
Date: May 12, 2019 12:11PM

It would look like that someone cobbled together an early model steering system into the late model housing / column. You'll have to decide whether you want to convert back to OE type setup or just repair what you have with an EM steering box. You have several options looks like. Sorry.

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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: May 12, 2019 12:19PM

I am going to try to remove the shaft out of the upper coupler first and use my rebuilt 66 gearbox. I am going to try to use a universal, extensions with the socket and ratchet to get the coupler nut and boly out so the shaft will drop out. Last shot at bolt and nut will be the gas tank will be emptied and pulled. Fuel level sender isn't working too good and might be time to see what is going on if tank comes down.

Al Lane
Ellabell, GA 31308

1966 Monza Coupe, 110 hp, 4 Spd
1966 Monza More Door 110 hp, PG
1968 Camaro SS Coupe 350 CI 295+ hp PG
1964 Greenbrier Deluxe, 6 dr, 80 hp car engine, PG
1947 Farmall A tractor 15 hp


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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: oldqmguy ()
Date: May 12, 2019 12:42PM

Al,

The '67 to '69 Corvairs used a 'short shaft' steering gearbox! The "Coupling" was moved to the 'bottom' of the steering shaft, making it easy to detach from the gearbox. I am not sure of the part number or if they are aluminum.

For '66 you are supposed to "drill an access hole in the splash shield" to get access to that coupler which is mounted at the 'top' of the shaft (next to the firewall). This is in the '66 supplement. The 'splash shield is behind the left front wheel.

I hope this helps.

Dale cool smiley

Dale E. Smiley CPBE
Life Member The Society of Broadcast Engineers
RETIRED Broadcast Engineer
CERTIFIED CORVAIR NUT
CORSA/Circle City Corvairs/Corvair Performance Group
Avon, Indiana
WB9SFF
1967 4-Door Monza PG!

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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: May 12, 2019 01:24PM

I figured out a way to do it. But because of the rusted bolt on the coupler, I need to take the shaft out of the column. Easier than pulling gas tank. Remove horn button, loosen nut on shaft and make flush with shaft. Tap shaft until it backs out of column. Remove nut, then remove shaft from column from under front of car. I have car up on jack stands, so there is plenty of room to maneuver shaft out of car. Then remove coupler bolt nut and the 14" steering shaft. Return this steering back to OEM parts.

Vairismo is right this car was cobbled together. Engine exhaust seat issue, dual brake line run without using second bulkhead block, new floor pans welded in without removing rusted metal. Single relay to run hi-flow fan and electric fuel pump. No seam sealer used in rear quarter inner panel replacement following weld-in of panels. These are just the hi-lights.

Al Lane
Ellabell, GA 31308

1966 Monza Coupe, 110 hp, 4 Spd
1966 Monza More Door 110 hp, PG
1968 Camaro SS Coupe 350 CI 295+ hp PG
1964 Greenbrier Deluxe, 6 dr, 80 hp car engine, PG
1947 Farmall A tractor 15 hp


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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Frank DuVal ()
Date: May 12, 2019 02:03PM

Not unusual to find an early short shaft aluminum box in a 67 to 69.

Reason? Many more earlies were parted out, so supply of short shaft aluminum boxes exceeds supply of short shaft cast iron boxes.

I’ve done it twice back in the day! Works just fine. No modification to the car, so a cast iron short shaft box can go right back in if one wants to.

You do have to grind a spot on the short shaft aluminum box to fit the 67 to 69 coupler. This must be ground in the correct spot. Looking at both boxes will show the box modification needed.

64 to 66 steering boxes are long shaft boxes, three different types, that do not fit cars not designed for them without column changing out.

You have two easy solutions, none of which involve your 1966 steering boxes. 1. Find a 60 to 63 box. 2. Find a 67 to 69 box.

Frank DuVal

Fredericksburg, VA

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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: May 12, 2019 02:36PM

Frank:

This is a 1966 Monza 4 Door made in November 1965. Who knows how many owners it has hade. I know the previous owner and he did not do this work or any of the other cobbled work previously mentioned. Vairiso was right. Easy cheap fix with parts on hand, or cheapest that could be had, by the person who did it. It was good enough for them at the time.

But not good enough for me. It will be made right. Donna will be driving it only when I am satisfied it will be safe and reliable. Brakes, steering and axle bearings are the last items to go through. When it is time to sell it, I will be confident, I did my best with it, not a "its ok as it is" type work on it. Yes, it will be sold, as it is a temporary classic to drive until the Camaro is back on the road. The Camaro is soon to be brought home where it is close to us to work on it without a 1 hour round trip each time.

Al Lane
Ellabell, GA 31308

1966 Monza Coupe, 110 hp, 4 Spd
1966 Monza More Door 110 hp, PG
1968 Camaro SS Coupe 350 CI 295+ hp PG
1964 Greenbrier Deluxe, 6 dr, 80 hp car engine, PG
1947 Farmall A tractor 15 hp


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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: 66vairman ()
Date: May 12, 2019 03:09PM

Yes on a later 65 or 66 the easiest way is to pull the entire shaft out as you said. Really the easiest way and you don't have to cut a hole in the body!

I'd also suggest pulling the steering mast as I bet the bottom ball bearing assembly is a mess (usually is - BTDT). I was surprised how much easier the shaft turned after I cleaned and lubed the bearing (it's comes apart and you can replace the bearing balls).

There should be a metal heavy gauge stamped support above the coupler on the outside that the steering mast bolts go into. Note there should be a BIG sheet metal screw holding it to the floor pan so you can start the bolts from the inside by yourself.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/12/2019 03:11PM by 66vairman.

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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Caraholic4life ()
Date: May 12, 2019 03:54PM

Al,
I know you have already invested quite a bit into the moredoor and are concerned about reliability and safety for anyone who drive or rides in it.

With that said, maybe a good option would be a New Replacement steering box like the one offered by Clark's?

[www.corvair.com]

NEW STOCK STEERING BOX - NO CORE
All new stock steering boxes now in stock, no core needed, these are not fast ratio, looks slightly different than originals.

60-63 and 65-66 short shaft C13375 $333.00

For 65-66 you also need C10011XA adaptor. $267.90

67-69 C13376 $341.00

1962 95 F.C. Van
1965 Monza Coupe
Westminster, Maryland

MID ENG enthusiast &
prior Kelmark owner.

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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: May 12, 2019 03:56PM

I didn't see a screw that held that big metal part on the forward side of the floor pan. I will look again tomorrow. If there is, Out it comes and then the whole steering column can then come out.

Thanks for the tip, Mark.

Al Lane
Ellabell, GA 31308

1966 Monza Coupe, 110 hp, 4 Spd
1966 Monza More Door 110 hp, PG
1968 Camaro SS Coupe 350 CI 295+ hp PG
1964 Greenbrier Deluxe, 6 dr, 80 hp car engine, PG
1947 Farmall A tractor 15 hp


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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: May 12, 2019 04:09PM

I have a good 1966 steering gearbox I am finishing up rebuilding. Actually I have two 1966 steering gearboxes. One is a quick steer box I learned after I rebuilt it. It will not go in this car. Donna doesn't need the extra effort to turn the wheel in parking lots when she visits the stores.smiling smiley

So, the second box has now had its new races and bushings pressed in and will be assembled tomorrow afternoon. The sector (pitman) shaft, worm gear and traveling ball nut are all in good shape. It should last for another 20 years, if car is taken care of. So it should last us the 2 - 5 years we will have the More Door.

Al Lane
Ellabell, GA 31308

1966 Monza Coupe, 110 hp, 4 Spd
1966 Monza More Door 110 hp, PG
1968 Camaro SS Coupe 350 CI 295+ hp PG
1964 Greenbrier Deluxe, 6 dr, 80 hp car engine, PG
1947 Farmall A tractor 15 hp


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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: May 12, 2019 04:13PM

Mark:

I read the 66 supplement and see the screw to remove. I will get it out tomorrow.

Al Lane
Ellabell, GA 31308

1966 Monza Coupe, 110 hp, 4 Spd
1966 Monza More Door 110 hp, PG
1968 Camaro SS Coupe 350 CI 295+ hp PG
1964 Greenbrier Deluxe, 6 dr, 80 hp car engine, PG
1947 Farmall A tractor 15 hp


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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Frank DuVal ()
Date: May 12, 2019 09:31PM

Quote
AL
This is a 1966 Monza 4 Door made in November 1965

Oops, I missed this part! Yes, proceed with your 66 box/column/etc. An excellent plan.thumbs up

I never did that swap (early box into 66)!eye popping smiley

Frank DuVal

Fredericksburg, VA

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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Seth Emerson ()
Date: May 12, 2019 09:50PM

Al - You may not need to remove the thick impact plate. The column comes out the top after those three bolts are removed - (Speaking of a stock 66 here, yours has evidently had "some work done"). But if you have removed the shaft - out the bottom - you should have no problem pulling outer jacket out the top. Here is my suggested solution, with an eye towards your wife's safety. Return it back to a stock 66 configuration, as you intend to do. There are two ways to remove the the coupler. Removing the clamp at the bottom is a noble cause - even with the right wobble joints, sockets and ratchets, it is tough. The other method is to pop out the large upper snap ring (safety glasses on, please) and let some of the parts remain on the upper shaft, with the coupler case dropping down and off. This is a messy choice, and it will involve some tricky re-assembly. Have your assembly diagram close by. If you do it this way, them pull the column up -with only the shaft and the cross-pin left on the end, the column, including the shaft can come up and into the car. It will not pull through with the coupler still in place. When you have re-assembled everything, and, perhaps, replaced the lower bearing, you can reinstall the column jacket and slide the shaft back into place, with the coupler fully assembled and ready to slide onto the steering gear. Where do you stand at this point?

Seth Emerson

Check my new Performance Corvair Web site [www.perfvair.com]

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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: May 13, 2019 04:39AM

Seth:

Column will not come out without doing one of two things. 1. Remove nut holding wheel to steering shaft and pull mast off. Then pull shaft out from front of car. OR 2. Pull screw and impact plate to take column out as an assembly.

I am going with #2 right now to get it out of the car. Then do #1 at the bench to allow ease of steering box installation into the car. Also check bearing in mast while shaft is out. Lubricate as needed.

Al Lane
Ellabell, GA 31308

1966 Monza Coupe, 110 hp, 4 Spd
1966 Monza More Door 110 hp, PG
1968 Camaro SS Coupe 350 CI 295+ hp PG
1964 Greenbrier Deluxe, 6 dr, 80 hp car engine, PG
1947 Farmall A tractor 15 hp


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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Ed Dowds ()
Date: May 13, 2019 05:13AM

Take note of what Seth wrote: there is a snap ring under the steering wheel on a stock '66 setup. You must remove it to pull the column jacket off of the shaft and into the car.

Ed
Hillsborough, NJ
66 500 rear 4.3 V6 Corvair
69 350/350 TH Camaro was RS
30 Model A Ford Streetrod 350/400 TH
88 Celebrity Wagon (Daily Driver)

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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: 66vairman ()
Date: May 13, 2019 08:26AM

Ed Dowds Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Take note of what Seth wrote: there is a snap ring under the steering wheel on a stock '66 setup. You must remove it to pull the column jacket off of the shaft and into the car.

Yes it goes against the top bearing in the turn signal switch. NOTE - there is a clamp and spring below the mast bearing that has to be adjusted to let the column PULL up about 1/8" so you can get the wire snap ring out of the groove. Too tight and you can't get the snap ring on or off - too loose and the steering wheel pulls up and down noticeable.

While the 66 steering shaft system is certainly safer in an accident and worth keeping intact - it's no fun to remove and repair. Fortunately it's usually a one time deal.

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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Seth Emerson ()
Date: May 13, 2019 08:42AM

I should have mentioned the small snap ring- often a bi*ch to get out. That is because the spring and clamp at the bottom (the one Vairman mentions) pre-loads the shaft, pulling it downward, trapping the snap ring. Maybe you could have someone push up from underneath? But if snap ring is removed - and, of course, the steering wheel is removed, the shaft slides right out the bottom, leaving the column jacket in the car. At that point, the jacket can be removed out under the dash, if you want.

Seth Emerson

Check my new Performance Corvair Web site [www.perfvair.com]

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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Wagon Master ()
Date: May 13, 2019 08:50AM

The is also a pretty involved procedure for installing/aligning the steering column mast jacket back in the car, outline in the appropriate year service manual.

'29 Ford Model A Tudor
'61 700 Lakewood 110 4 speed
'69 Monza Convert. 140 Auto.
'70 Dodge Challenger R/T 440 4 speed

Been aircooled since 1973
Northwest Ohio

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Re: Where was this steering gearbox used?
Posted by: Lane66m ()
Date: May 13, 2019 09:59AM

I get it. It is a lot more involved job than building up an engine. I have printed out the 65 manual pages and the 66 supplement pages. They will be on the box next to me if I need to look at them again. Going to work on it now.

Al Lane
Ellabell, GA 31308

1966 Monza Coupe, 110 hp, 4 Spd
1966 Monza More Door 110 hp, PG
1968 Camaro SS Coupe 350 CI 295+ hp PG
1964 Greenbrier Deluxe, 6 dr, 80 hp car engine, PG
1947 Farmall A tractor 15 hp


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