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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: kenzen ()
Date: March 15, 2020 09:52AM

Yeah Baby!!! Bottom line up front: This is how the car should have come from the factory. I dove into a small radius traffic circle down the block from me that used to be a hand-over-hand operation, but it's now "point and shoot". Thumbs up Matt!

I wound up putting 1/2" spacers in between the plate and arms, which gave me about 1/4" clearance between the rims and the outer tie rod ends. (I'll have to watch my fingers...)

Useful Corvair fact for this mod: The bolts holding the factory arms are 2 different lengths - 1 3/4" on the forward bolt and 1 1/2" on the rear bolt. The 1 1/2" was too short for a 1/2" spacer, so I scavenged the longer bolts out of a set of spindle/hub/drum assemblies I had around. The 1 3/4" bolts could comfortably do another 1/8" shim if necessary.

Useful tip: Per Matt's directions I measured the distance between the inner sidewalls to reset the toe-in to. To make setting this up easier, I cut a length of 1/2" electrical conduit (EMT) to the exact length, and stood in on blocks between the tires so all I really had to do is equally dial the tires toward each other, and then shift the whole to get the steering wheel centered again.

I'm going to take it for a "real" alignment, but its close enough that I don't feel or hear anything strange.

Ken

kenzen
66 Monza Coupe 110/PG
Bel Air, MD

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: MattNall ()
Date: March 15, 2020 10:35AM

Life is good! So much more fun to drive!

MODERATOR
Sea Mountain, between Charleston Harbor and Coos Bay! SW Oregon Coast
Click HERE for My Website...Click HERE for My TechPages!
...............110-PG.................................................Webered-Turbo

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: Ron62 ()
Date: March 31, 2021 05:24PM

I have Matt's steering arms and love them. My only real issue is no steering stops. Has anyone who has these arms figured out a good way to install steering stops?

Ron62
1967 500 Coupe 110 PG
Residing in Massachusetts.

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: MattNall ()
Date: March 31, 2021 05:45PM

Ron, just set the wheels where you them stop and weld in something that will stop them.

MODERATOR
Sea Mountain, between Charleston Harbor and Coos Bay! SW Oregon Coast
Click HERE for My Website...Click HERE for My TechPages!
...............110-PG.................................................Webered-Turbo

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: Ron62 ()
Date: April 02, 2021 02:52PM

Still trying to figure out where that actually should be. Ill take another look at it this weekend. I was just wondering if anyone had done it yet.

Ron62
1967 500 Coupe 110 PG
Residing in Massachusetts.

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: MattNall ()
Date: April 02, 2021 07:10PM

NEW SALES POINT COMING SOON!!

MODERATOR
Sea Mountain, between Charleston Harbor and Coos Bay! SW Oregon Coast
Click HERE for My Website...Click HERE for My TechPages!
...............110-PG.................................................Webered-Turbo

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: azdave ()
Date: April 03, 2021 05:55PM

Ron62 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have Matt's steering arms and love them. My only real issue is no steering stops. Has anyone who has these arms figured out a good way to install steering stops?

Yes folks, Matt has given me the opportunity to become the new source for his QS arms but I need at least another week to get the initial units ready for those on the wait list.

While waiting on the raw parts from the fab shop, I may have figured out a solution to add a steering stop. It will probably have to be a plasma cut piece as it is a bit much to make with hand tools but the good news is that it looks like it will be a bolt-on part and a relatively simple add-on to any of the installed QS arms that Matt has already sold. I made up a prototype part for the driver's side and will try to install it soon and do some test drives on a LM. It works pretty well during bench testing so real world drive testing comes next. No pics yet until I at least get a few miles on it and see if I have forgotten any details. I think it will work the same on an early model but I don't have one of them around to recall if they are set up the same as a LM steering stop.

Dave W. / Gilbert Arizona
65 Corsa 140/4
66 Corsa 140/4
66 Corsa 140/4 w/factory A/C
66 Corsa 455 Toro V8
65 Monza Convertible 110/4
66 Monza Convertible 140/4 A/C
65 Monza 4DR 140/PG w/factory A/C
65 Monza 4DR EJ20T/5






Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/03/2021 05:59PM by azdave.

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: isucorvair ()
Date: April 06, 2021 09:29AM

Now....can Matt find another supplier for the Big Single exhaust?


Eric P.
DeWitt, IA

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: MattNall ()
Date: April 06, 2021 09:43AM

isucorvair Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Now....can Matt find another supplier for the Big Single exhaust?
==================================================================

not at a price we can live with..sad..

MODERATOR
Sea Mountain, between Charleston Harbor and Coos Bay! SW Oregon Coast
Click HERE for My Website...Click HERE for My TechPages!
...............110-PG.................................................Webered-Turbo

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: joelsplace ()
Date: April 06, 2021 11:37AM

I'm working with a friend that has a Chinese supplier to make something like that in stainless. He's thinking we might be able to do it with muffler for around $300. Hopefully a complete system in stainless with headers for around $600. Is there a market???

Joel
Northlake, TX
5 Ultravans, 116 Corvairs and counting...

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: doug6423 ()
Date: April 06, 2021 12:34PM

joelsplace Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm working with a friend that has a Chinese supplier to make something like that in stainless. He's thinking we might be able to do it with muffler for around $300. Hopefully a complete system in stainless with headers for around $600. Is there a market???

I'd be interested. I'd like to photos and such. I currently run Clarks' dual exhaust that bolts right to the heads. And I like the sound of it.

Doug
65 Monza
Cincy, OH

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: AZ Troy ()
Date: April 06, 2021 07:09PM

Very nice work Dave. Are those Plasma or Laser cut?

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: OttawaCorvairGuy ()
Date: April 06, 2021 07:48PM

Not sure how Ackerman could ever be adjustable. Bumper steer I can understand.

But the Ackerman Theory is not the same thing as bump steer. ggg

I hope I can do this justice:

Ackerman theory is based on three fixed points.
It only meets the true Ackerman theory - if the fixed points line up and thus the tie rod falls in line.

As Brent from Fatman Fabrications said in one of his videos. (That I watched years ago)

The Corvair is one of the cars that the Ackerman theory does not apply.

WHY:

If you were to do as the Ackerman theory says and draw two lines, one from the imaginary center point of the rearend through the center point of the front driver's side ball-joint and repeat that on the passenger side to form a V.

There is NO WAY - for a forward outer tie rod to fall in line with those parameters.
Because the mounting point on the steering arm, for an outer tie-rod would have to be on the outside of a front tire to line up properly - to meet the Ackerman theory. GRIN & LOL

The use of the Ackerman theory on CCF for Corvaars, has always made me laugh.
It is like those who call Amway a pyramid scheme, to this day.

It does not apply and it does not make it so. ggg

BTW - Brent went on to say something like: with the cars that don't meet the Ackerman theory - you set them up the best you can with what works best for that car.

Don't hold me to it.
But I think he went on to say that Chevy trucks do that.
They set them up to work the best they can.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/06/2021 07:55PM by OttawaCorvairGuy.

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: MattNall ()
Date: April 06, 2021 09:06PM

OttawaCorvairGuy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not sure how Ackerman could ever be adjustable. Bumper steer I can understand.

> The use of the Ackerman theory on CCF for Corvaars, has always made me laugh.

> BTW - Brent went on to say something like: with the cars that don't meet the Ackerman theory - you set them up the best you can with what works best for that car.
===========================================================================

As I explained the last time you brought this up:

The basis of "Ackerman" is that the INSIDE wheel in a corner deflects more than the outside, to eliminate "tire scrub"

Those of us who have completed a "performance Vair" and have"mechanical aptitude", put that to work to eliminate our notorious "Tire scrub", made worse by most A-M "quick arms"
Read my original AD for my arms where I explain HOW!

MODERATOR
Sea Mountain, between Charleston Harbor and Coos Bay! SW Oregon Coast
Click HERE for My Website...Click HERE for My TechPages!
...............110-PG.................................................Webered-Turbo

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: azdave ()
Date: April 07, 2021 05:42AM

AZ Troy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Very nice work Dave. Are those Plasma or Laser cut?

Plasma. I'm using the same job shop that Matt used in Oregon to cut and bend the blanks because I haven't been able to source local fab shop here in Arizona yet. Good news is that the parts are exactly the same as what Matt was supplying. Bad news is that they increased the price by over 50% and I have to pay shipping to get them to Phoenix.

The final tool arrived last night to complete the arms. At the inside of the 90-degree bends for the two smaller holes, the area where the nuts sits is sometimes not completely flat due to the bending operation. I purchased a spot facing tool and then made my own pilot insert so it will machine that face to be parallel with the opposite side. A minor detail but it bugged me when it wasn't always flat on the side near the bend.

Dave W. / Gilbert Arizona
65 Corsa 140/4
66 Corsa 140/4
66 Corsa 140/4 w/factory A/C
66 Corsa 455 Toro V8
65 Monza Convertible 110/4
66 Monza Convertible 140/4 A/C
65 Monza 4DR 140/PG w/factory A/C
65 Monza 4DR EJ20T/5



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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: VairKing ()
Date: April 07, 2021 09:00AM

FWIW, I work in the sheet metal industry and purchase millions of dollars of steel every year and raw steel material prices have pretty much doubled in the last 4-5 months. As a job shop we pass these increases along to our customers, who in the end pass it to theirs and eventually we all end up paying.

Not trying to start another topic, but just letting everyone know the shop charging 50% more is pretty justifiable, at least during this time period.

_________________________________________
Ryan Counterman (Moderator)
1965 Corsa Kelmark V8 400 HP ///1965 Monza Sedan 110/PG /// Ultimate Corvair Hauler/// Don Eichstaedt's 1965 Corsa Racecar
West Michigan Corvair Club /// 1966 Corsa GTP Convertible Mid Engine 3.8L Supercharged project stalled

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: Phil Dally ()
Date: April 07, 2021 10:55AM

Quote
azdave
I may have figured out a solution to add a steering stop.

Put me on the list to buy...I have an uninstalled set for Zonker.

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: azdave ()
Date: April 08, 2021 05:13AM

VairKing Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> FWIW, I work in the sheet metal industry and purchase millions of dollars of steel every year and raw steel material prices have pretty much doubled in the last 4-5 months. As a job shop we pass these increases along to our customers, who in the end pass it to theirs and eventually we all end up paying.

Thanks for confirming it wasn't just this shop being greedy. I had every intention of selling these for the same price as Matt but I can't with that kind of cost increase.




Phil Dally Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Put me on the list to buy a steering stop...I have an uninstalled set of quick arms for Zonker.

Phil, You are on the steering stop waiting list. smiling smiley

Dave W. / Gilbert Arizona
65 Corsa 140/4
66 Corsa 140/4
66 Corsa 140/4 w/factory A/C
66 Corsa 455 Toro V8
65 Monza Convertible 110/4
66 Monza Convertible 140/4 A/C
65 Monza 4DR 140/PG w/factory A/C
65 Monza 4DR EJ20T/5



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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: toms73novass ()
Date: April 08, 2021 05:39AM

Dave, I might also be interested in stops, I have 2 sets of Matt's arms.

-Tom


63' Monza Spyder Convertable (in process) MY Build Thread
65' Monza MY Build Thread
73' NovaSS 454 Big block (Sold)
86' BMW 325es
98' VW Jetta TDI, for daughter
01' Audi Allroad Stage 3 twin turbo
67' UltraVan 211 "Violet"
NFCC, UMCC
Grand Island, NY

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Re: Quick Steering arms-- Different than any others. And Adjustable
Posted by: joelsplace ()
Date: April 08, 2021 06:33AM

Excellent visual on how much they move the tie rod vs stock. Maybe do one vs the Clark's quick steer arms?
I'll need 5 sets of stops. Thanks!

Joel
Northlake, TX
5 Ultravans, 116 Corvairs and counting...

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